No. Just no.
Via Amanda Terkel at Think Progress, we find that a Louisiana justice of the peace has denied a marriage license to an interracial couple, his reasoning being for the children's sake. From AP:
"I do ceremonies for black couples right here in my house," Bardwell said. "My main concern is for the children."Bardwell said he has discussed the topic with blacks and whites, along with witnessing some interracial marriages. He came to the conclusion that most of black society does not readily accept offspring of such relationships, and neither does white society, he said.
"I don't do interracial marriages because I don't want to put children in a situation they didn't bring on themselves," Bardwell said. "In my heart, I feel the children will later suffer."
If he does an interracial marriage for one couple, he must do the same for all, he said.
He also added, "I try to treat everyone equally," and when he says "equally" he means he lets his black friends use his bathroom:
"I'm not a racist. I just don't believe in mixing the races that way. . . I have piles and piles of black friends. They come to my home, I marry them, they use my bathroom. I treat them just like everyone else."
Angry Asian Man says it right, "Well, that is great. I was mistakenly under the impression that he was one of those racists who makes his black friends pee in the backyard. Turns out, he treats them 'just like everyone else.' Except when it comes to letting interracial couples get married."
Pam and Racialicious have more.
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I have only three words for this story:
What. The. Hell.
I have piles and piles of black friends.
Did that sound totally gross to anybody else? Piles? Really? Typically used to describe things, not people...but maybe that's the point.
What, you don't make piles out of your friends? It's the only way I can get all of mine to fit in the corner.
that's one of the first sign of a racist person. "I'm not racist! MY BEST FRIEND IS BLACK!"
Well yeah, obvs. People seem to have this ridiculous idea that as long as they disagree with slavery or don't go around murdering people of color, they're not racist. Anything less severe than "not allowing POC to exist" doesn't, like, count as racism. Yeah, ok guys.
But again, hearing him describe them as "piles"? That's a...well that's a first for me.
This guy goes further. Not only does he have black friends, he also permits them to use his bathroom.
Shucks, does he let them eat food from his dinner table too? He's like a real-life Atticus Finch.
How does this dude even know the couple is going to have kids? Seems like a minor point in the face of the mindblowing racism, I know, but still.
Not only is this guy a major douche, he's also helped set back the racism conversation a few steps by giving white people the handy out: "Well, I believe in interracial marriage, so I'm not racist." From this website alone, it's clear that racism isn't usually this in-your-face. But it's much easier to talk about this sort of incident and think that racism is something those crazy people do, not us.
The more I think about this, the more ways in which I am offended.
Let's look at what he didn't say:
1. "I know what 'black society' thinks." (Related: 'black society' has a single opinion)
2. "All people are either white or black."
3. "If you get married, you must have kids."
4. "If you don't get married, you will not be able to have kids."
5. "I have a heart."
I think I'm going to add "But think of the children..." to my racism bingo card.
Did this guy not get the memo about Loving v. Virginia? I mean, REALLY.
A 32 year old Supreme Court ruling is no match for the out-dated moral convictions of a Louisiana Justice of the Peace!
I'm suspicious of anyone who measures their friends (black or otherwise) in piles.
I can't tell you how sick I am of the "But it's for teh childrenz!" excuse for racism. Are biracial children really that much of a threat to society? Or do these people just think that being biracial is a punishment to children? FFS.
Biracial children aren't a threat to society but you'd have to be totally ignorant of the black community as a whole to even think for a milisecond that being biracial is not something widely or universally accepted within the black community as a whole.
Even President Obama has been called out as being not black enough because of his status as a biracial man but if you ask him and let society tells it- his white mother is either completely irrelevant and Obama is purely a black man or she is the end all to be all in reminding people that he ISN'T a black man- his father is.
I could go all day about this. But even still this guy had no right to deny a marriage license based on race even if her parents were memebers of the Klu Klux Klan and his folks were fans of the notorious "Zebra Killers." But let's not answer his racism with delusion that biracial children are livng th ebest of both worlds with an abundance of acceptance by all.
Are you suggesting that black people don't accept interracial children??? Because for most of the last 400 years black ppl were the only ones accepting interracial children. Heck, you can't find a black person in this country who's 100% black.
The point made by a handful of black 'intellectuals' about Obama wasn't that he wasn't black enough because his mother was white, it was that he wasn't black enough because his father was Kenyan. And to the extent that Africans and African-Americans are vastly different they were right...but since he was raised here in the US & never knew his father they were very, very wrong.
Cattracks I can ASSURE you, as a biracial woman that what I said is true.
You wont hear this on FOX news or CNN you'd have to go to TVONE or another BLACK media outlet to actually hear more about this. Like I said many people ignorant of the true goings on in the black community as a whole know SHIT about that.
The lightskin/darkskin issue amongst the black community started amongst those who were mixed to begin with from slavery. The lighter slaves being given the lighter housework and on a whol ebeing treated slightly better than the darker ones. The issue with hair texture amonsgt black people is ALSO rooted in someones status of being biracial. Many a young black girl was either glorified or villified for looking too white or not being black enough, dark enough in skin, hair or eye color. And if she EVER was so bold as to NOT agree that all white people were to some degree racist she'd be outed as "one of them."
There are biracial children who have racist grandparents who wont accept the "tar babies" "porch monkeys" of half breeds" they refer to their own flesh and blood as.
But if this isn't YOUR reality if it isn't somethign your priveldged bubble has exposed you to- its something you know absolutely nothing about it. If your only exposure to racism are white people who are AFRAID to be deemed racist then you really haven't been exposed to much.
My knowledge of the fuckery of racism along the spectrum of races and even against and within races is vast- far more than I wish I could have ever known. So please- take your indignation and place it on someone else with the priveldge of not knowing what I do know.
We've come a long way since Gwendolyn Brooks poetry about interracial prejudice, but, yes, the light skin/dark skin issue is still a problem in this world, not just the U.S.
We've come a long way since Gwendolyn Brooks' poetry about interracial prejudice, but, yes, the light skin/dark skin issue is still a problem in this world, not just the U.S.
"But if this isn't YOUR reality if it isn't somethign your priveldged bubble has exposed you to...take your indignation and place it on someone else with the priveldge of not knowing what I do know."
Wow. What makes you think I got this from CNN or Public Radio? You think you're the only mixed race, or black person who visits this site? I don't need to watch CNN to know what its like. I speak from personal experience. I shouldn't have to prove my ancestry to someone I've never met, in order to make a simple freakin post. You've become as cynical as the very people you complain about.
And while its obvious that you've been really screwed by racists apparently of multiple races, in general black ppl have been the only ones to welcome mixed race children. In a lot of living, in a lot of place, you're the only one I've ever known to dispute that. There's a reason that most mixed race people identify as black, not white. That's because for nearly 400 years that was the only place we could find acceptance.
Because of what you said and how you said. You first question my personal experience and that of thousands of others on many other major black-community blogging websites because YOU have a different experience.
You think all biracial children are ACCEPTED by the black community? How many of these biraciam children identiy as "only" black and how many of them have the audacity to recognize their biracial heritage amongst those who "accept" them? Which community are you referring too? The elite group of black Americans who are highly educated and grew up in liberal suburban areas where racism was something they simply saw or read about on TV or are these the black Americans who were sadly ON the news and the victims of the racism most people simply saw on TV or read about?
We who found acceptance where? Is that why TYRA BANKS has episode after episode about dark skin vs. Light skin? Why CHris ROck did a documentary about "good hair?" Why Ophrah has done shows addressing the same issues of being biracial? Is that why many "African - American" studies include pieces about the issue is because WE are only accepted by the black community? MANY a biracial man or woman "passed" or continues to "pass" within the white community. Halle Berry is BIRACIAL but how many times has she been described as "black" or African-American byt he very people who are supposed to be accepting her biracial self???? That's like saying a transgendered man is accepted by people who either 1) never knew he was born a woman or 2) ONLY accepts him if they get to pretend like he was born with male genitial THATS NOT ACCEPTANCE!!!! Accepting these biracial children would mean recognizing that they are not ONE race- they are both. They do not "belong" to the black community neither do they "belong" to the white community they are however a PART of BOTH communities and until we've reached that point its a freaking farce to call it anything other than what it is- rejection.
I didn't--and would never--comment on your personal experience. I don't know you. You're the one repeatedly assuming you know me. What makes you think I grew up in some "liberal, suburban enclave"? So not only do I have to prove my ethnicity, I have to prove my class status, and neighborhood upbringing to you? Seriously. Puh-leeze, I'm from the 'hood, actually the projects, so stop w/ the Oppression Olympics.
I'm reacting to your broad generalization that black people haven't been accepting of mixed race children. And as both a historical & empirical fact, I can say categorically that that's absolutely not true. Until recently Black Americans were the ONLY Americans who accepted mixed race children. Now, I appreciate you've had your own challenges w/ racism, but don't malign all of Black America because of your specific case...heck, there's not a black American who's not mixed race.
actually, no
that is not true.
Most identify based on what the public perceives us as.
If you don't look WASP people tend to think you are "other". One of those "others" is AA, but, it's often a general "of questionable ethnicity" othering. If they didn't ask, it would be a non issue.
Also, in this ridiculous country we live in, we have the "one drop law". There's no choice in the identification if you go by that.
Once you walk out your families door, it mostly depends more on what you look like.
my comment was a direct response to this line:
"That's because for nearly 400 years that was the only place we could find acceptance."
You think white people, like say, um Strom Thurmond, have been welcoming bi-racial children for the last 400 years? Really???
So, would you prefer to identify as a White person?
If so - why?
Another thing. He DID know his father. His father left at a young age but he knew who he was and what he was- a leader in Kenya which sparked his interest in leadership. Something that has had a HUGE impression on him since he was a very small boy.
Although the marriage was brief- Obama's mother and fathere WERE indeed married before they part ways.
And if you think the questioning of his blackness was left within the black elite who said his father's status as a KENYAN-American ( I loathe the term African American you KNOW which country in that continent his father is from) then you're sadly mistaken. Look back to his reaction to the Sean Bell incident in NY. He was accuse dof being distanced from the incident becaus ehe was biracial and didnt understand the struggles of the average black man growing up in America as if most people wouldn't look at him and assume he was NOT biracial, as if he never encountered racism, as if nobody ever looked at him funny when his parents showed up at school and the first thought that crossed their minds was "maybe he's adopted."
Cattrack, it's definitely true that when white men had children with their female African-American slaves, the African-American community was the one left with full responsibility for their children. But like Phenicks is saying, it is also significant to note that, just like misogyny from women, we find racism from POC directed towards biracial people -- or really, from everyone.
My friend has a mother who is (working-class and) black and a father who is (wealthy and) white. His father is Dutch, actually, and his last name, Oversier, refers to old Dutch men who were "Overseers" of slaves. The terrible position he is in is apparent, right there in his name. While his mother is an absolutely amazing and strong woman, whom I respect immensely, and who is like family to me, my friend has not always felt accepted by the black OR white community as a whole. I especially remember this being hard for him in high school. Though the problem is not just with POC -- he recently was referred to as "blackbird" by a co-worker who was disgusted that my friend was drinking beer instead of whiskey in a fancy whiskey bar???
I think the problem becomes very clear when you think about the problems with albinism not just abroad but in the United States as well. I spoke to an albino girl in Pennsylvania who told me that she had nearly been strangled to death by her aunt. http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/LN561656.htm
It's a big mess.
Interracial kids often face a lot of prejudice and identity issues. The fact that nearly all African Americans have some white ancestors is irrelevant, it's an issue of the parents' appearance and culture, not genetics.
Well my rhetorical point was, it's people like these, kicking and screaming that the children won't be accepted, are the same people who are making it so the children aren't as accepted in either community. I am a white woman, and as a teen I was told by a family member not to marry a black man because the children would suffer because they wouldn't belong in either community. My retort was, "Oh, you mean, YOU wouldn't accept my child." The argument is so damn thinly-veiled they may as well out and say "I don't think the races should mix" and be done with it. Does that mean the reality is that biracial children are always accepted in both communities without equivocation? Of course not; of course they struggle for acceptance in this racist world. I never said so (and I don't think I implied it). But it does mean that the assholes saying "Don't have an interracial marriage because the children won't be accepted" are exactly the same individuals who won't accept the children. They're just calling out entire communities for their own racism.
I agree that the same people who say "what about the children" may have their own prejudices but who are these people saying it? How are they saying it?
TO deny the marriage license is obvious where he stands. But for someone to simply warm- do you know what you're getitng into? Have you considered what you would do or how you would react if? is another. I have a friend who's mom is white Italian-American, father is a black Jamaican-American and though her maternal grandparents makes it a point to show their disapproval of her existence the mom still naively thinks they will "come around" and pressures her to come to family dinners to subject herself to her grandparents racism. The father and mother divorced long ago because they couldnt see eye to eye on how that should be dealt with. I'd wager a dollar to a dime this was never even considered when they had children so there was no unified plan on how to move forward and their breakup was inevitable because of it.
You'd think we'd be past this sort of racism but then again we are still living in times when not too long ago- a black man was dragged to death by a car and the white men who did it received NO jail time. This was within the past 10 years. So really, who are we fooling by pretending there are no hard feelings lingering about this sort of thing?
Sorry, but, speaking as a biracial person here (White father, Black mother and born a year before Loving v Virginia) I have to call bullshit.
I've never felt any stigma from other African Americans about being a Black person with a White father (in fact, most other Black people assume I'm just a lightskinned Black person - unless they actually knew my father or I told them, they generally don't know that I had a White parent).
And, of course, there are plenty of examples of famous Black people with a White parent who are widely accepted by African Americans (Halle Berry, Melyssa Forde ect).
Ah, the charms of the south. One of these days I'll need to confront my prejudices and fears about the non-coastal/chicago parts of the country, but not today...
Like Chicago isn't racist as all hell?
Of course not! Plus, they have unicorns there. I'm moving ASAP.
And quick geography update: Most of the south is "coastal." Could you clarify your regional prejudices really fast?
Sure: I'm biased toward dense urban areas. I have an irrational fear of rural areas and think that they have a higher-than-average proportion of religious nutbags, racists, and meth addicts.
That help?
Sure: I'm biased toward dense urban areas. I have an irrational fear of rural areas and think that they have a higher-than-average proportion of religious nutbags, racists, and meth addicts.
That help?
Sure: I'm biased toward dense urban areas. I have an irrational fear of rural areas and think that they have a higher-than-average proportion of religious nutbags, racists, and meth addicts.
That help?
MLK said Chicago was the most racist place he ever visited...which only suggests to me that he should've spent more time in Boston.
I've heard New England called the South of the North.
Boston is the most racist place I've ever visited - and I've actually been to Jena, Louisiana!
I moved from the South to Chicago. Everyone would ask me about the horrible racism in the South, totally not noticing the racism all around them.
In the South, at least it's out in the open. It exists in the North, it's just more subtle, or behind closed doors.
Isn't Chicago the most racially segregated city in the nation?
Racism - not just for Southerners anymore!
I hope this guy gets disbarred ASAP
gee, let me tell my mom and my sister that we are screwed.
"I don't want to put children in a situation they didn't bring on themselves"
hahahaaaaa
omgoodness, I fell out laughing at that statement. Hilarious!
I know, I know, of all people,
I should be completely offended, I can't help but laugh at that poor idiot of a man.
And so, post-racial America continues its foray into unprecedented freedom and equality for all citizens, not just those with pale skin. After all, we invite black people inside our houses these days. Sometimes, we even let black people use the same toilet as we do. We're so benevolent and kind.
Seriously, how is it even sort of legal to deny a couple the ability to marry based on race these days?
It's not, and hasn't been since 1967.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loving_v._Virginia
I kind of figured... I'm just still slightly confused at this man's refusal to marry the couple. And, you know, his assumption that it was ok for him to refuse them.
Does he realizes that, in essence, being all white, all black, and living are situations children do not bring on themselves?
He denied a marriage license to two adults who want to get married just because he thinks that children they don't even have yet will suffer because the people who want to get married aren't of the same race? Leaving aside the racism he's shown (which other people have dealt with far better than I can)...who says that denying them his permission to marry will stop them from having kids if they want to, anyway?
And where does this guy get off, pretending to be noble when he's just outed himself as a racist?
I totally agree with your post!!! You made the best point. Depriving them of a marriage license will not 1) stop them from getting married in the first place- they can always go to Vegas 2) stop them from having children 3) end the discrimination faced by interracial couples 4) prevent their biracial children (if they even want to have children) from being *screwed* or hurt by their *pure* black or white family members.
But most of all SCOTUS precedence in Loving v. Virginia states that you can't deny the right to marry to couples based on race or their status of being an interracial couple. I hope they sue him and have a HUGE wedding on his dime.
Phenicks, I think you made an even better point than I did. :) I didn't know about the Loving v. Virginia thing (I'm Canadian, which may or may not be a valid excuse). So, not only is this guy a paternalist and a racist, but he's violating the law he's supposed to be upholding? Wow. I hope he ends up in about six worlds of trouble for this.
'"I don't do interracial marriages because I don't want to put children in a situation they didn't bring on themselves," Bardwell said. "In my heart, I feel the children will later suffer."'
Is this because only same-race babies consciously decide to be born?
That certainly recalls fond memories of lily-red rural Louisiana. And by rural I mean twenty minutes from New Orleans.
Give this guy a break!
He said he lets them use the toilet, for goodness' sake! What more do you want!?
So, what, is he going to deny a marriage license to poor couples? Because I'm pretty sure poor kids don't ask to be born into poverty (which itself is a huge imediment in the life course)? Oh, wait, I forgot. This is America and anyone can just pull themselves up by their proverbial bootstraps and reach the pinnacle of success. Riiiigggghhht.
His logic is insanely tortured and his racism apparent despite his feeble, overly-rationalized protests. What a grade-A asshat, not to mention poor arbiter of the LAW.
Maybe the children we should be worried about are those of the JoP.
Maybe the children we should be worried about are those of the JoP.
This attitude goes hand in hand with "I don't mind black people, so long as they don't move next door, date my daughter, or bring down my property value."
Please, think of the children.
There's one argument that the marriage equality people haven't used: "If we ban same sex marriage then public officials will start openly questioning the validity of interracial marriage." I mean, if you personally don't agree with it, why should your government recognize it? This seems to be the best way to make policies.
Yeah, being interracial can leave you with a lot of identity issues, but show me any life situation that doesn't come with it's own set of problems. Is this enough of a reason though to imply, as this judge did, that we shouldn't even exist? I don't think the interracial people of the world need this judge's so called "concern".
We have our own problems with racism here in Canada, but some the things that judges and senators say in the U.S. wouldn't even be tolerated from a radio talkshow host in Canada.
Seriously, they let this guy be a JUDGE?
He's not a judge. He's a justice of the peace. It's an elected volunteer position, and it doesn't even require a law degree.
I'm amazed that the U.S. allows important legal positions to be elected. Judges and justices of the peace need to have legal qualifications and be impartial.
I don't know how important justices of the peace are, it sounds like they handle fairly routine functions that would waste the professionals' time, and this guys managing to bungle the easiest job of all.
California elects Supreme Court Justices, but Cali is dysfunctional approaching failed state status.
Rebecca Walker, our freaking current president, and myself turned out just fine. Oh yeah, and all of these people: http://www.mixedfolks.com
I know that only pointing out famous/successful people kinda of skews the conversation, but I feel that it's necessary to do so after this man has taken such a huge shit on our right to exist.
Most of us eventually figure out that we are neither this nor that, that people will undoubtedly claim or reject us as they see fit, and that our mere existence can be used to start conversations about the fact that race is CULTURALLY determined and that racial characteristics are not ingrained in our very DNA. Hell, in Brazil they have over 100 different races and, despite all the shit the Europeans did in Latin America, at least there were little to no taboos against marrying and reproducing with people of another skin tone.
""I don't do interracial marriages because I don't want to put children in a situation they didn't bring on themselves," Bardwell said. "In my heart, I feel the children will later suffer.""
I wasn't aware that issuing the license meant he had to be the one to preside over the ceremony. I really can't come up with a more coherent response than that.
My uncle and aunt were an interracial couple. He was black, she was white. I think they got together in the seventies, or possibly the late sixties, but it was at a time when that sort of thing Wasn't Done. We live in southern Ohio, a stone's throw away from Kentucky, and they had a hard time of it. Most of her friends cut her out of their lives for marrying Greg, and even some members of her family did some nasty things to her house. It was bad stuff.
But by now, one of my sisters is married to a black dude, and another one has a biracial daughter. No one in my family seems to care, or at least they have the decency not to care out loud. I'm actually kind of surprised that interracial marriage is still a thing that people object to strongly enough to decide who can and can't get married. Honestly, I thought we'd all agreed as a culture that bigots had to move on to hating the homos. I mean, that didn't make any more sense, but this just kind of seems old timey. This is the kind of racism that should be described in sepia tones.
I seriously thought that our society had gotten past this kind of thought. Then again I also thought our society had gotten past the thought that only white christian male property owners should have anything to do with our government too. Its a sad sad day when this kind of thing happens. And not only that isn't it illegal to deny someone a marriage license if they are single and wanting to be married to the opposite sex? There really are not laws in place to prevent this kind of thing? Really?
Gallop poll has an interesting video clip about the changing attitudes of Americans towards inter-racial marriage. They've broken down levels of acceptance by age, region, race and political affiliation. I found some of the results surprising.
For the Canadians reading this thread, I found a report on inter-racial marriage in Canada and the U.S. We're much more accepting of inter-racial marriage in general, and with 99% of Canadians under 35 approving of white/black marriages things are only getting better.
But, but, our PRESIDENT is biracial!
What do you mean the children will suffer????
"Oh, so sorry Jimmy and Sally, you might become the most powerful person in the free world someday, and we wouldn't want you to do something like that, now would we???"
The logic fail astounds me!