I'm always interested in the ways in which feminists and other activists (myself included) struggle to make the leap between our ideas and our daily lives. Sometimes it seems like our intellects are so on fire that we forget to truly internalize, or more likely, we're simply unable to. It's one thing to realize that you are performing your gender when you shave your pits and that you don't want to do it anymore; it's another to cease to do it despite what your aunt might say when she catches sight of those black sprigs of hair.
Sometimes it's not as straight forward, of course. Just because I've realized that the thin ideal is bullshit, doesn't mean I don't sometimes feel less than glowing about my shape. The political and the psychological do not always line up. Here are five ways in which I'm still struggling to square up my ideas and my daily practice. (Note: this is not meant to be a feminist litmus test of some kind, just a list of things that I personally realize are counter to my own feminist ideas and behaviors that I would like to stop. You may be just fine with saying sorry by instinct or think that it's fine not to feel equipped to crunch numbers. The point is to reflect on your own gaps.):
1. I apologize and say excuse me far too often in public situations when I am just taking up a normal amount of space.
2. I get intimidated when math comes up in daily life situations--whether it's splitting a bill among friends or trying to focus on the specific allocations in the stimulus package when I'm reading an article.
3. I feel like I have to wear makeup in certain situations even when I don't want to. At first I chalked this up to an age thing...I'm young so I have to wear make up in certain circles to be taken seriously. I'm starting to feel like it's just an excuse. (Unless I feel like wearing it, which happens sometimes, and that's cool.)
4. I still say no to friends or loved ones with a lot of trepidation, even if I know that they are asking me to do something I'm not interested in or don't have the energy for etc. You might argue this isn't gendered, but in my family, it certainly was.
5. I sometimes listen to my guy friends objectify women and say nothing. It feels exhausting and killjoy-ish. Part of me feels like I should give myself permission to not be the feminist police all the time. Another part wonders if I just have a hard time doing the hard confrontation shit with my own buddies.
What are yours?
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Feminism is not new to me, but identifying as a Feminist is a relatively new thing. For me, just saying that out loud...to PEOPLE was terrifying. I always felt that i had to back that statement up with years of research and familiarity with feminist literature to substantiate my claim. No more. If i have learned anything, it is that my beliefs are valid, that my intellect is strong, and that my words are important. It took me a long time to believe that, especially when it came to voicing my opinions about such "guy" topics as the Civil war (which i love), military history (again, LOVE), or art.
I would also like to address the body image and feminism topic. I was severely Anorexic in highschool, and will always struggle with the anorexic voice in my head. I am pursuing my masters in art therapy so i can equip girls with an expressive and creative way to just BE girls. I never feel less of a feminist when i stare in the mirror and see a huge set of hips, or when i ask a friend if i look "fat." I feel strong, bc i know that i have a skewed perception of my body and i NEED help to challenge that. That is what makes me a feminist in this; i cannot fight the media or my peers who endlessly discuss the latest diet fad. What i CAN do is continue to be honest with myself, and to help young women love themselves for who they are and what they can DO.
I use "I think", "in MY opinion" and other qualifiers to soften my statements. That's a very typical "female" speech pattern. We worry that we might come off as too aggressive, too bitchy, too argumentative and that we'll push people away. Instead, we end up sounding meak, uncertain and non-expert-like.
Blogging has helped me a lot with this. I just go back and edit all the qualifiers out. Speaking is harder, but god knows I try.
I'm male and I do this all the time, too. In my mind, this is respectful or at least accommodating behavior. That is, when I'm making declarative statements or offering opinions to other folk, I usually want to signify that I don't necessarily think I'm "right" or that others who disagree are "wrong" or to foreclose discussion. However, I definitely recognize that it is due to male privilege that I usually don't worry about coming across as meek or uncertain when I do this.
I certainly did not mean to suggest that qualifying one's statements is NEVER right. To the contrary, I think that many people do not do it enough.
I also think that there are a lot of cultural differences that are at play here... What seems desirable to me (I'm Bulgarian) would be considered VERY rude in other countries.
What I DO believe though is that many women doubt their knowledge and expertise and hesitate to share their opinions in public because of the way we've been raised (be nice, don't argue, know your place). Check this great piece over at MobLogic on the subject: http://www.moblogic.tv/video/2008/04/08/where-my-ladies-at/
It's kind of interesting because I've heard the opposite-that many women aren't likely to say "I think" because the theory is "who care's?" they aren't told that their thoughts are important, and so stick to facts. I'd be interested to know how common one or another is-I have made an effort to say I think more after reading that, now I'm less thrilled about that.
I have to agree with cr. As a male, I almost always use qualifiers in arguments and everyday speech. I've always thought that declaring your opinions as fact gives off a generally unattractive air of smugness and arrogance, and often times leads to looking unintelligent... Part of it may just be my reserved nature and tendency to pick my arguments, but i no way find that to be either a feminine or negative quality... Anyways, if there's one thing I've learned, it's this: Never use absolute statements.
(irony intended)
Yes, yes, yes. I do this in many situations -- mostly around older people and women, actually -- despite the fact that I have very strong convictions, political positions and debate skills and am well-spoken, not to mention totally comfortable arguing a point to friends and family.
Your comment reminded me of an interesting study about the gender distribution in expert vs. personal blogs. The results were astonishing. There are VERY few women who write "EXPERT" blogs... Most women's blogs are personal, i.e. they feel more comfortable to document their own lives and the lives of those around them. Most expert blogs are written by men... I won't say anything about their level of expertise. ;)
and why not?
come on thats sexist.. and it won´t make it any better if it comes from "the other gender"
I do this all the time, and I am constantly getting mad at myself because of it. Though I realize that some men also use "I think" and "In my opinion" qualifiers, for me it always feels as though I'm succumbing to paternalistic standards that have historically dictated that my beliefs as a woman are not as important or valid as those of a man. As an example, I frequently get into political debates with one of my boyfriend's conservative (and arrogant) male friends, and as we're debating a topic I always notice myself saying: "Well, in my opinion. . ." or, "Well, I just think that. . . ", whereas he tends to phrase things as: "Look, Laura, this is what you don't understand. . . " (My meekness is countered by his condescension. At least, I take the moral high ground.)
However, I have been making a conscious effort to avoid these "softening" phrases, and last night I had a breakthrough moment. He and I got into a very heated argument about the importance of environmentalism and voting for politicians who support environmentally friendly policies, and despite his belittling tone towards me, I held my ground and made a firm and compelling argument, with no "In my opinion"s.
I know exactly what you mean, though I find that instead of "I think" etc I tend to unintentionally make every statement a question by raising my pitch at the end of the sentence (as you do when asking a question). I learned about this in one of my group psychology classes as one of the common (unconscious) tactics used by women to make their statements less threatening because it turns every statement (essentially) into, "dont you think that...?"
(Un)fortunatly, I have begun to use it as a conscious tactic. I am very outspoken especially within male groups of friends (and female for that matter) and I have found most will just shut down and block me out or even change the subject if I begin to talk about anything related to feminism etc. So instead I ensure to make my statements into questions so as to allow the conversation to continue. While it feels like selling out at times I feel justified at times because if I can keep the discussion going and perhaps enlighten someone, then I feel it is worth it.
Oh my. I work in a male dominated environment. In the corporate workplace, for those of you not yet there, there are certain patterns of speech which are acceptable, and others which are not. The patterns of speech which are acceptable are things like: "What I'm hearing is ... " as opposed to "You said ... " or "It seems like ... " as opposed to "This is the situation ... " The savvy reader has already figured out that the more acceptable speech patterns are very feminine is style, with qualifiers rather than assertions. Get this though - from men, those words show consensus building. From women, they show lack of certainty.
To be honest, I don't think it's a problem that women qualify opinions, I think it's a problem that men don't. Men tend to state their own opinions as if they are irrefutable facts.
If I'm ever watching TV with a guy friend and he says something like "that girl's ugly", I like to respond "you think she's ugly, that doesn't mean she IS ugly". I usually get and "okay well yea..."
Despite what hacks like Deborah Tannen and Robin Lakoff would have you believe, hedges are not "women's language". They are often simply the language of the powerless*; other times, they're just a way to bring others into the conversation and keep them engaged; other times, they're just courtesy.
* Yes, women are all too often the powerless. However, if you pay attention, you'll find that this kind of language is very common from, for example, men who testify in court for the first time. When you remove the names and gender-identifying pronouns from court transcripts (to keep this example going), Mark the layman eyewitness sounds like Maria, and Jen the forensic expert sounds like Jon. When that happens, it's time to abandon the old canard about "women's language" and focus on the real issue, which is the balance of power between the genders in modern society. Instead of trying to stop saying "like" and "I think", you can focus on why you're expected to do all the shitwork in conversation--and maybe on why men are never made to feel guilty about the way they talk.
I don't blame you for buying into the hype about "women's language". It's pretty common. But it's worth educating yourself about it. "Women, Men and Language" by British sociolinguist Jennifer Coates is a great start.
Playing the martyr and feeling sorry for myself when I have to do a ton of housework after an exhausting work-week. I promised myself I'd never get up on a cross...
I'm curious as to why math is a gendered issue. I feel intimidated when math comes up in my daily life, but that's because I don't enjoy it and am not good at it. (I had to take my second year of algebra twice in high school.) This is why I opted for a qualitative major in college (history) and employ calculators for menial tasks at work and home. For me, it has nothing to do with being female. It has to do with my mathematical capabilities, which, I'll be the first to admit, are sorely lacking.
It's a very pervasive stereotype that girls and women aren't supposed to be good at or have the "innate" capacity to be adept at math. Girls from a very early age receive messages from their teachers, families, peers, and culture that they aren't good or are not as able as boys in mathematical skills. It is a tragedy that many young females succumb to these stereotypes and just assume that they aren't adept at mathematical functions (I'm not making this particular statement about you specifically, toricore). Cultural reinforcement of this stereotype range from the talking Barbie doll many years ago who said, "Math is so hard!" to Lawrence Summers, former President of Harvard for suggesting that unequal performances between men and women in the "hard" sciences might be attributed to genetic differences.
This is definitely something which affected me when I was at school, despite my family who were very encouraging of my academic abilities. I always got good grades all round at school, but the only area in which I thought I might not be able to succeed was maths. I was so confident in everything else, but with maths there was always this nagging doubt that I would hit a wall at some point and not be able to get good grades. The funny thing is, I was actually very good at it -- I took it until I was 18 (for those who aren't in the UK, every subject is optional beyond 16) and easily got an A grade at the end.
My school was pretty feminist (a girls' school linked to the suffrage movement!) and our wonderful woman headteacher taught me maths at A Level. But it still got into my head that as I girl I would just never be innately as good at maths.
You know I always found this to be a strange stereotype. From my experience of being in a high school classroom, the number of girls who received an "A" in math far outnumbered the amount of guys.
When I was in eighth grade in my lower middle class public school, I took an advanced algebra class. There were 23 girls and five boys in that class. When I took AP Calculus in 12th grade, there were 18 boys and three girls. I don't think 20 of 23 girls grew less intelligent in the interim. Something else held back the fulfillment of their potential.
Yes this is true but I'm in the same boat as Toricore b/c at my teeny, tiny hippie elementary school, I was not taught to believe I was bad at math. However, I hate math and I always have.
For me, math competency isn't a gender issue that I worry much about but I understand why it is for other people who have reason to believe they actually are good at math and it's just a cultural stereotype telling them otherwise.
I see math very much as a gendered issue. I've always excelled in math and I am a mechanical engineer. Tons of people respond with disbelief, shock or even anger when they learn what I do. My male friends don't share the same experience.
But is that a sexist stereotype applied to your math abilities or to your career path? From my experience, engineering has always been a male-dominated field, while fields in the natural sciences appear to be split evenly among the sexes. Do you think people would have the same reaction if you were a biologist? You would need to have similar math capabilities for that position.
fields in the natural sciences appear to be split evenly among the sexes
Physics PhD chiming in: no, no they are not.
I'm a math girl too (undergrad and grad school in engineering) and I loved watching people do a confused double-take when their assumptions about girl=bad at math got blown apart. Some PEOPLE are good at math, some PEOPLE are not...most PEOPLE are average at it. Duh :)
I bow down to you math savants. Male and female.
"5. I sometimes listen to my guy friends objectify women and say nothing. It feels exhausting and killjoy-ish. Part of me feels like I should give myself permission to not be the feminist police all the time. Another part wonders if I just have a hard time doing the hard confrontation shit with my own buddies."
I deal with the same thing, especially with my boyfriend. With him I'm more comfortable with pointing out sexism, but I feel like that's all I talk about sometimes (which points out that there's way too much sexism, but we already knew that). With my family, if I point out the sexism I'm seen as crazy. I feel like I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place with this issue.
I feel the same way. People in my family just don't get it, and it's such a hassle to explain and fight with them, I usually just let it slide.
Me too! My partner is a feminist, but he definitely gets sick of me always pointing out the things in our society that are sexist, racist, classist, heteronormative, etc. I often get the "here she goes again..." vibe from him, which upsets me, puts a strain on our relationship, and also stifles any potential for intelligent discourse on the matter. So, I've been silencing myself more, which is not good and not very feminist, I know.
Also, sometimes I feel bad about my body.
Also, sometimes I enjoy watching really un-feminist television or movies, even though there are countless ways in which I recognize that they are offensive.
That used to happen a lot with my boyfriend a lot. Then one day I broke down crying telling him I wanted him to care more when I talked about those things, because they're important to me. I think because I framed it in that way, it made him more willing to listen and talk with me.
me too!! my boyfriend usually gets it and doesn't make me feel i'm harping on insignificant little nothings, but a lot of his friends, who are now are mutual friends since we've been together so long, do. i was raised by a really egalitarian family in a really liberal community, so being politically correct was always the norm, and i was always taught to call people out when they say sexist/racist/heteronormative/classist/etc things that perpetuate stereotypes, etc etc.....but i don't live in the same community anymore, and my/my bf's friends are from a really different background so i've had to hold my tongue so many times--they see the criticism i've given in the past as personal attacks rather than societal critiques, even though i would usually phrase it gently, jokingly, or as a question (aka, "what does that have to do with sexual orientation?" etc)...i actually got in a huge fight with his best friend last year about sexism and our kickball team that was just full of ugly misunderstandings...ugh...i've mostly given up being the p.c. police with them
I completely understand your statements. I've learned to pick good spots to make my commentary, when I feel it can be especially effective, those "teachable moments", if that's not too cliche. Sometimes I feel like I'm harping on the sexism, esp when it comes to mainstream media, BUT, my boyfriend and some of my male friends have recently admitted that they find themselves noticing these things in TV shows and movies and even have joked that I've brainwashed them...mwhahahah! Every little bit helps, I suppose. :)
I still give my husband the big piece of chicken.
That made me laugh out loud.
Me too! So funny.
I love the chicken example. It also made me laugh out loud. It seems so silly... but it's totally one of those automatic things we do. The guy or the head of the family gets the bigger piece of meat. On the other end of the spectrum, I get so worked up about "things" not being fair in my relationship that I find myself measuring out food in this completely OCD manner. I had to learn to be OK with giving my boyfriend the bigger piece of chicken not because I was giving him more to my detriment or to defer to him, but because most of the time I know he's going to eat my leftover chicken bits anyway. Sweet potato fries, on the other hand, get measured out in an exacting manner so I don't feel gypped. :)
The chicken bit might sound silly,but the truth is that most women give their husbands/ boyfriends/male children a bigger portion of food because we assume that just because they are male they NEED to eat more.
And I learned in college that not only do men, in very many cultures, get the most food; they usually get served first. Mothers dole out food to their husbands first, their children second, and themselves last. In places with food shortages, this often results in malnutrition falling into a gendered pattern.
Assume? It could very likely because the men in their lives actually eat more. Generally men tend to require more calories, given the same amount of activity.
From what I have observed, in general, most men eat more and quicker than most women. You could argue that this is because men are greedy and they could live on considerably less, but most people eat until they are full. That and a faster metabolism in men often means they eat more (compare a shrew to a tortoise)
My girlfriend lets me each whatever she can't finish or doesn't like because, in most cases, I eat twice, and sometimes thrice the amount she eat. But I often compensate by giving her the choices parts (more tender chicken parts, more cooked portions). etc. That and usually she eats much of the dessert then I do!
In Asian culture, for adult men and women, it is important that we serve our parents first. (when the children are small, of course the parents serve the children first). A man who was served by his mother would be deemed an "emperor" or "spoilt". Similarly, it is customary for the man to pick out and offer his girlfriend/wife the choicest parts of the meal.
Come on, you really can't say that that is rooted in sexism... Yes, i eat a lot more than my girlfriend, and i outweigh her by 50 pounds... does this somehow make me a bad person?
I agree with what you said, and have found that I fall into this pattern too, but I feel like I need to nitpick just slightly. Most people actually aren't aware of this, so I'm sure you didn't mean anything by it, but the term 'gypped' is actually a racist term referring to gypsies. The idea is of course that they will short change you in some way.
Not trying to be hostile, its just a thing I think more people should be aware of.
Thank you! I noticed the use of that term, too, but decided not to say anything because I was certain the commenter was not being deliberately insulting or hostile. I'm glad you mentioned it. Actually, even the use of the term "gypsy" is problematic for many Roma people, so I try not to use that term either.
I didn't actually know that there was anything wrong with the term gypsy. To be honest its not an issue I was even aware of until I started listening to a lot of Gogol Bordello songs. I think its interesting/awful that there are still a few cultures that it is entirely culturally excepted to make fun of. I live in West Virginia, and I would argue that 'Rednecks' (which actually means farmer, the back of their necks would become sunburnt) is another group. What term is preferred? Just Roma, or is that less specific?
Sorry for the tangent!
Not every Roma or Romani person views the term "Gypsy" as pejorative. Some embrace it. But the basis of the protest seems to be that the word "Gypsy" was assigned to Roma people by the dominant white European cultures because it was thought that they originated from Egypt. (They actually originated in India). Many Roma people don't like being referred to by a name that was forced on them by a different culture and that is based on ignorance of their own culture. Just as many Native people in the U.S. dislike the term "Indian". But I'm unaware of any dissatisfaction with either "Roma" or "Romani", so I stick with those.
I wonder if I overeat to copensate for the smaller piece?
Excellent example.
I do that, too. Or the piece that's more tender, or more evenly seasoned, or, or.
LOL! I do the same thing for my bf, but mostly b/c he's twice my size and seems to have a hollow leg where food is concerned.
When men I don't know randomly command me to smile, I don't explain to them why that's a fucking rude, sexist thing to do. I just grunt at them and refuse to smile.
Yes! Ugh! It's so hard for me to gather the guts to do this...but then if I don't, I end up stewing about it and over-analyzing for hours and hours! i.e.: "Why didn't I just say something? I could have just given him the finger... But then he'd say something back and make it look like I was overreacting and people on the street would chalk me up to "another crazy feminist"... etc etc...
I almost prefer it when they use the "you'd be so much prettier if you smiled line" because at least then I can respond with something like, "And you'd be less offensive if you minded your own business." I really want to take some time and think of really clever responses and print them on business cards so every time someone tells me to smile I can give them something with very witty one-liners.
Ha! Awesome.
Once, and only once, I shouted, "Fuck you!" in response to the "Smile, honey, aren't you going to smile at me?" shit.
The guy said, "But you look like such a nice person. You're really a bitch, you need a boyfriend, I'll fuck you, then you'll be nice to me" and so on and so forth. Because the ONLY possible reason I don't want to smile at you is because I really, really just need to be fucked.
Which goes to prove that the guys who trot out the 'smile' shit are not, in fact, just being friendly when they see a cute girl, as they claim when this subject comes up in a mixed-gender discussion. It's pure misogyny and entitlement all wrapped up in a rape threat.
Wow, Jena, I never realized but that really bothers me too! Like when I'm upset, and my boyfriend, instead of trying to get to the root of the issue and helps me, makes stupid jokes and says "come on, I just want you to smile." I think I get it now; it's no one's right but my own to decide when the HELL I'm going to smile.
Thank you for this!
I'm an unfriendly person (and a male at that) who is constantly being asked to smile, and I've finally raked up the nerve to tell people to 'fuck off!' Why the hell should they care about your facial expression in the first place?!?
You could always try, "I don't even know you!"
I suspect that the response would then be something along the lines of, "We should get to know each other, sweetie pie, don't you want to come here and talk to me?" coming from a condescending total stranger, to whom I am not obligated to provide with time, attention, or anything else. That is exactly the kind of entitled bullshit I'm trying to avoid when I don't make eye contact with a "Smile!" dude.
The 'hey, c'mon, smile!' line really gets to me, specifically because I work in a grocery store. I know I'll get into trouble if I talk back to customers and coworkers but I'm all too aware that my male coworkers never have to hear that crap.
I suppose I could have responded to that better. Perhaps the men at work do get that every once in a while, but the other girls I work with and I get it so often that I find it hard to chalk it up to just that we provide a public service as cashiers.
I completely understand! What is it about the smiling thing!? It bugs me to no end.
My mind says: "Sorry, Patriarch, but no I don't wish to grant you control over my facial expressions."
My mouth automatically smiles awkwardly and then I usually leave feeling like shit...RAWR.
Thought you non/smilers might enjoy this one:
http://genderagenda.wordpress.com/2009/01/08/youd-be-so-much-hotter-if-i-kicked-you-in-the-balls-more/
I question the rationality of people who decry body piercing and tattooing whilst at the same time they wonder why the imac, mascara and shaving regime isn't up to standard.
Your number five is a big problem for me. I don't want to stand out in certain groups. Luckily I haven't hung out with any of those people in a long while.
I don't know that being intimidated by math is necessarily gendered. I get nervous when I try to do stuff I don't feel good at.
As far as ideals, I don't know. Mine is pretty much "people should be kind to each other." Does that qualify as feminist, or not?
Regarding the math one...I struggle with whether it's gendered but I have pretty much decided that, for me, it is--at least in part. I decided at a really early age that I wasn't good at math and I think it had a lot to do with a male elementary teacher who made me and other girls feel sort of dumb in front of the class. I think he was sexist and so I sort of internalized that idea, even if not totally consciously. I don't have to be a genius at math to be a feminist, but I do need to feel capable when I really am.
If it bothers you that much you should try brushing up your math skills-- even working through some problems in a test prep book should help you become super confident with things like splitting the check. If you want to get into higher math it will take more time, but for everyday stuff you should be able to be happy with it pretty easily if you take some time to practice when you're not on the spot.
Not calling my father out on some of the shit he says. When we debate it tends to get loud and he enjoys baiting me... I just can't put up with the headache and then I get annoyed with myself afterward.
I get the math bit too, along with some other things at random times (might be car or computer related). It's not that I'm not capable, but they're things I don't find that interesting and haven't spent much time with. So I fear something of the XKCD "Girls suck at math" response. Because one girl, of course, can't just be bad at something as an individual. It's sex based and they're representative of the whole.
I'm almost to the point at times where I annoy myself with all of my, shall I say,
"harping" (there's a word right there that could fuel more discussions) on the subject of sexism. But there's just so much of it out there.
I need to figure out a way to turn my brain off and let my body and soul recharge for a few hours.
This happens to me frequently with my boyfriend. I try to challenge him whenever he says something that's retrograde or prejudiced, but sometimes I'm tired.
I also refrain from confronting his family when they make worse remarks.
My father is exactly the same except he goes one step further and watches extremely graphic tv shows in front of me and then wonders why I get shitty (wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that he knows I was abused as a kid and doesn't give a shit now would it?). It makes me sad that fathers can treat their own daighters like crap. I always have a part of me that hopes that other fathers are out there standing up for their daughters.
Number five is a good reminder we need a book of smart, sharp, snarky feminist comebacks to stupid sexist putdowns. The wittier we are, the less anyone can claim we're humourless... And it's more fun to crush the enemy with style :)
I like to use the small penis excuse, personally, even though it's kind of fighting sexism with sexism. Particularly, when I'm being objectified.
Them: Hey, you've got big tits!
Me: Hey, you've got a tiny penis! Later.
Thanks for opening this discussion. I'm right there with you on #1, 3, 4, and partly 5. Body image is a daily struggle.
Another constant struggle for me is unequal cooking/cleaning duties between me and my partner with whom I’ve lived for nearly 4 years. I hate that 7 years after learning about the “second shift” in my intro to women’s studies class, I find myself with my own second shift while he doesn’t. The feminist ideal for me would be to share the workload equitably (esp. since we both work full time outside the home) and the reality is I do at least 85% of it. This is something he knows I’m upset by (& something I feared when we moved in so I came armed with division of labor charts that disappeared pretty quickly), and while he is respectful and great in all other aspects of our relationship, it is not an area he is willing to change.
Why do I keep doing most of the cooking & cleaning? 1) I don’t want to spend $ going out to eat all the time or live in a pigsty, which is what he’d probably do if he lived alone 2) growing up I was trained to clean and I find it a hard habit to break; 3) I was raised to take care of others and I have a hard time not taking care of him in this way 4) part of me feels guilty for making half of his salary and like I have make up the difference by keeping up the household. Not once has he said or implied this; I just feel it.
If I hadn’t learned about the second-shift or seen female friends & relatives in the same position as me, I would chalk it up to personality differences, but I do think there’s a lot of gender socialization going on in this aspect of our relationship and I hate it. There is little incentive for him to change and I’m not going to leave him over this, so I feel stuck with and also a bit ashamed of myself for having an imbalanced second-shift.
I feel you.
I do most of the cooking (frankly, I am a better cook so that's something I can forgive to a degree) in my relationship. And with cleaning, I end up either A.) Constantly asking my partner (male) to scrub the bathroom/vacuum/do dishes/whatever or B. Doing it myself.
He's an adult. He should be able to look at a sink full of dirty dishes and say "Those need to be cleaned. I'll do those now," not "I'll do them later when she gets home, sees them and looks disgusted."
We've had talks about this and it'll get better for a while, but then it backslides.
And I realize that part of it is due to him growing up in a household that wasn't all that much for chores and cleaning. (His parents were divorced, he lived with his mom, and she's got the same pack-rat and lack of cleaning tendencies that he does.)
But I get this little niggling voice in the back of my head that asks me "why are you stuck doing all 'woman's work'?"
Wow. You hit nails 1-4 on the head...I've lived with guys before and had those problems too, and like you, it bugged me on two levels...the one where I hated doing the damn chores and I hated that I was doing them as the second shift. After living by myself for several years, I think I've gotten really set in my mostly neat ways and think that my best friend's advice "Live with someone cleaner than you or you'll end up doing all the work" might be spot on!
Nevertheless, I do have a boyfriend who I spent about half my time with and I am making a conscious effort to start things the way I want them to be ongoing (I have learned precedent is POWERFUL). I like to cook and am good at it, but I require the kitchen to be clean before I'll set foot in it and if I cook, I'm not going to clean up. I realize that I am more of a neat freak and am willing to compromise, but only so much. He in turn is learning to notice when things need to be done and is trying to meet me halfway on the chores if he wants me to spend more time with him. If we ever end up living together, I hope we can work it out to be mostly equitable. I think household chores are a HUGE and unrecognized form of conflict in otherwise equality-based relationships!
I've always found that whip-smart humor is a good way to point out someone's sexist missteps without the boys thinking of me as a killjoy. It both silences the bs and let the guys know I can "hang". They respect my humor and directness, and are reminded of our common humanity. It also kills my own nervousness in the situation.
Math is a problem for most people, but the trick the guys often use is "fake it 'til you make it", which usually has mixed results. Discover what you are good at, and highlight those characteristics. Confidence will catch up to you, and you can then pursue the things that give you trouble.
When splitting a bill among friends, what I and my business partners (and friends as well) do is split everything equally unless one person happens to have a few drinks or something else extra that makes a huge difference in overall cost. In that case, we split the main costs minus the one person's expensive drinks.
A somewhat non-feminist note: many restaurants HATE serving groups of women because we often nitpick our parts of the bill so much, and then leave crap tips on top of that. We tend to do this more than men, and it drives servers crazy. Here's a hint: use a cell phone calculator, or just have everyone throw in a card or cash and tell the server to split it all up evenly. If any of you out there are too broke or otherwise too stingy for that, then have the server write up separate tickets for everyone WHEN YOU ORDER. It will save a lot of time and bullshit.
I'm a businesswoman and used to be a waitress, and have seen a lot of this happen over the years. I went from a punk rock wallflower to a loudmouthed punk-rock wallflower, and have found that grace, confidence and feminism are things that evolve with us. Not many of us are born perfect; we're an ever-changing project.
A somewhat non-feminist note: many restaurants HATE serving groups of women because we often nitpick our parts of the bill so much, and then leave crap tips on top of that. We tend to do this more than men, and it drives servers crazy. Here's a hint: use a cell phone calculator, or just have everyone throw in a card or cash and tell the server to split it all up evenly.
My friends and I have always used this method: one person pays for the bill, then once you leave the restaurant, you can work out the bill and pay the person your portion of the meal. No one’s fussy enough to count to the exact cent, mostly because we never want to be bogged down by too many coins. I feel that this way, your waiter/waitress can process your bill speedily, and you can work out your portion of the bill in leisure.
I also apologize WAY too much. It's like I'm apologizing for my very existence.
I put way too much importance on whether or not I get complimented on my looks. And furthermore, I internalize any comments I get on my looks to a ridiculous degree. I remember them way longer than I should.
I feel bad for making my husband move to England and put his career on hold - for one year - so that I can get my master's degree. However, I happily moved to another city so that he could get his in three.
At my family gatherings, the women always end up doing all the cooking and cleaning, while the men just sit, eat, and sit some more. This makes me so angry I sometimes can't breathe, but I don't say anything in order to avoid conflict.
Confession: I am a fat woman and I wear Spanx to more than just special occasions. I wear them A LOT. I wear them too much. I do this because I feel like now, without them, I am jiggly and shapeless.
Agreed on paragraphs 2, 4, and 5 (I'm not married and still an undergrad). I hate going to see my mom's side of the family because we women have to hang in the kitchen while the guys (and my dad does look uncomfortable about this, but that's because he's annoyed by their values) watch football and drink beer. Ugh.
I definitely agree with you on the weight issue. Even though I hate the "you must be thin" ideal, I still feel inferior to some of my thinner friends. And it drives me absolutely insane.
As someone who is naturally really, really skinny (skinny enough to make people think I'm anorexic) I find that I feel like I have to make excuses for being the way I am. The thing is just as much as some people would like to be skinnier sometimes I would like to actually have a figure that resembled something more traditionally "womanly" rather than my current bag of bones. I guess my point is, don't feel inferior to skinny girls, because most likely we're jealous of you too! I wish everyone could be accepted just the way they were without judgements either way.
Another point on the math-thing: you might look for other women in your school or who are teaching math for a boost in your own confidence. Role models help us A LOT; I think I was raised as much by Gloria Steinem and Wilma Mankiller's words as I was by my own mom, who spent a great deal of time clinically depressed and melancholy because of my old man's near-constant abuse when I was a kid.
The power is ours, but we need to look to one another or within from time to time to find out way to it.
You're definitely right about the role model thing - my dad is a math teacher/professor, so growing up, math was this cool and fun thing to do, like solving puzzles. I was always better at it than my brothers, and this made my dad super-proud, so I never really saw it as a gendered issue.
But I guess that really points out how gendered it could become, what with some sexist male and female teachers and parents out there. I can't tell if it's because my dad's a feminist or because he loves math more than anyone on the planet that I never had crazy math anxiety. So if all kids have positive math role-models, both male AND female, they won't see it as a boys-only skill.
I still struggle with other people's opinion about my appearance -- especially men's opinion.
I know this is the beauty myth taking control of me, despite the fact that I know better, but sometimes, if I go out and my friends get more male attention than me, I cannot help but feel a little sad.
I've never been happier with my body and my looks than I am now (and feminism definitely helped A LOT with this), but patriarchy still whispers in my ears sometimes.... So sometimes it's like my own opinion and the love I feel for myself aren't enough until somebody else validates it.
But it's a slow process. I'm sure that, with the years, I'll get better at this.
I know what you mean about your friends getting more male attention. I live with three other girls, two of whom are thinner than I am. I still feel bad when they get more attention than I do. And I hate it.
Word on the thin thing. I used to be thin before I went on psych meds, and noticing that men suddenly can't see me solely due to my size is a bitch. It did open my eyes to thin privilege, though, and I'm glad I don't have to pass through life blind to that particular issue anymore. It's still hard not to internalize that shit. I have passed up many, many opportunities to confront people about sizism because it's too fucking tiring and embarrassing. A lot of times I think just pointing out the obvious fact that I'm larger than many other people will make them like me even less, when I shouldn't give a shit whether or not they like me in the first place.
I get stared at all the time because I'm thin but I definitely recognise it's because of that, and my blonde hair rather than my face/intelligence/sense of humour etc. Sometimes I wish I could be invisible to guys like that because having them act like they own your body is disgusting. It's like we're either property or worthless and it's yet another form of sexism that a lot of men just don't get
A male lawyer I know once said to me:
"The first thing you need to do is STOP APOLOGIZING FOR EVERYTHING!"
I find myself occasionally apologizing when I don't need to even now, and it's a hard habit to break. It feels good to be conscious of it enough to not do it nearly as often as I used to, though, and I find that the more often I do not apologize inappropriately, the better I feel and the less often others can abuse me when something doesn't go right.
Your subconscious brain might think being forever apologetic solves the problem, but it only takes care of it in the short term, as those you repeatedly apologize to come to you whenever something goes wrong. They drain your life-essence and your energy, and still have a huge problem to deal with at the end of the day. Often, it had nothing to do with you in the beginning, but because you stepped up, it's now yours to deal with.
One good thing my mom did for me was to make me solve problems on my own when I was a young child, even if she felt she needed to apologize to me. She was tired a lot and couldn't solve my problems, which helped me become stronger in the long run, even as she wilted. I revisited this technique after talking to my lawyer friend, and now use it to get others to solve problems rather than just talk about who caused them. It destroys the pointless Circle of Blab, and gets us all on the move.
(1) Feeling like the condition of the house/quality of hospitality to guests reflects on me, and not on my husband. Worse yet, having the same attitude towards my partnered female friends.
(2) Despite knowing that the purpose of street harassment and cat calling is to make women feel that the public sphere is man's domain, not always confronting my harassers or men harassing other women in my presence.
I definitely agree with you on both!
I so agree with the first one! I feel like my boyfriend's messy place reflects badly on me and I don't even live there.
1. I obsess over my looks sometimes, particularly my weight. I know that women come in all shapes and sizes, but when I'm having a bad day, I'll daydream about how much "easier" life would be if I was skinny. I know that that's not true, btw.
2. I laugh at sexist/racist/classist jokes. Laughter is my automatic response to being offended or uncomfortable, so that's my rationale. Also, I like to think that by finding offensive jokes funny, I'm pointing out flaws in stereotypes ("x is funny because it's NOT true, although people believe it to be"), and therefore subverting them.
3. I apologize a LOT. My mother even gets on me about that.
I wear make up a lot, but I love putting it on and don't feel the need to apologize. If I don't want too, I won't. But let's see, I dance for like 10 hours a week and sometimes will be late to school if I have to shave my legs/pits for dance which is ridiculous but I just can't go out with hairy legs.
I too don't call people out on their shit as much. I used too but got a reputation as miserable at times.
*to, agh
1) Criticizing myself for not looking "feminine" enough. Turning to my boyfriend after I put on an outfit and asking him if I look "mannish" ("boyish" I don't mind, and of course this equation of infantilization with feminism when it comes to personal style is also problematic). Feeling like I have to compensate for the schlumpy sweater by wearing a necklace or mascara.
2) Finding that, on the other hand, I do feel comfortable looking "masculine" when I'm wearing or doing something professional. Whenever I've gone on a job interview in a pant suit, I haven't really minded wearing little to no make-up or jewelry. I know that this professional = acceptably un-"feminine" trope is not something into which I should buy as a feminist, even unconsciously in my choice of clothing.
3) What somebody else said: Tempering my statements with "I think" and "in my opinion!" I find I do this around women more than men; perhaps I don't want to come across as that woman who shouts down the other women, I don't know. Perhaps it's my own internalized belief that other women are more meek than other men and can't hold their own in an argument with me. I have very strong convictions and political positions, and I seldom shy away from an argument or full-blown critique -- but I do find myself tiptoeing in my explanations around older people, authority figures (usually male) and most women.
4) Cooking dinner for my boyfriend and myself just about every night. Granted, I do this because I like it, enjoy cooking and quite often explicitly tell him not to grab food on his way home because I plan to try out some new recipe. But it feels weird developed into a habit, and I sure wouldn't mind if he could cook me dinner sometimes (I'm sure he couldn't).
...of course this equation of infantilization with feminism when it comes to personal style is also problematic...
That should read "femininity," not "feminism." Ha.
Number 5 resonates a lot with me. My fella has a couple of guy pals who like to totally dominate any group conversation and believe that the only thing that is funny and humorous is misogyny. Hours at a bar listening to these two list women who, they feel, deserve to be characterized as a bitch or a c*** is draining and upsetting. When it was made clear that I didn't appreciate this, I was quickly characterized as a prude and extremely fragile woman. Because their misogyny was all part of a hilarious joke, they feel that they can say remarkably hateful things and get away with it.
I find that one thing that takes me away from my "ideal" feminist existence is when I am encounter someone who unexpectedly reacts angrily to even the word "feminist." Since I'm in academia, I expect to have debates about ideas, and I'm happy to have an intelligent discussion about such things, but being yelled at and insulted for simply using the word "feminist" throws me so much that I'm often unable to respond.
May I suggest this for a response: "What's your f*cking problem, asshole?"
Thanks for the advice. It's good to remember that sometimes you don't need the witty/clever comeback to make your point!
There's such a fine line between being a nice person/being polite and letting people run all over you because you're a girl. I think 1 and 4 are good examples of that.
Interesting that you associate wearing make-up with being young and wanting to be taken seriously. I would think many older women wear make-up to try to look young and therefore be treated better. Either way, it's 100% a gender issue. Men aren't exactly getting in line at the make-up counter either to look younger or be taken more seriously. I actually tend to take people less seriously who wear make-up. It's a semi-unconscious bias, but it's definitely there.
1. Caring way too much about how my physical appearance is being perceived to others. If I feel someone says something negative about my physical appearance, it really gets to me. I wish I could change this soooo very much.
2. Not putting my foot down all the time when being harassed/cat called.
3. In a similar vein, there are times when I find myself playing into the sexist framework that someone is putting me in at a given time-- for instance, if a client at mine at work is treating me more like a nice sweet daughter-figure of his, there are times when I slip into this role instead of aggressively asserting myself as his equal. Its not all the time. There are times I find myself very feisty. But times when it seems very easy to stay sweet and smile and hurry along until said person leaves.
4. Similar to your #5- Often remaining silent when people close to me say things. I often do speak up but there are times I dont have the energy AT ALL.
5. Watching Gossip Girl.
This feels like Confession. :)
I was waiting for someone to bring up "Gossip Girl".
I feel guilty every time I watch and always feel so conflicted: how the hell am I supposed to accept a character like Chuck Bass? He's a two-time attempted rapist and disturbingly emotionally abusive to Blair. How the hell am I supposed to accept Serena being labeled a "slut" when guys on the show sleep with/cheat on whoever and get away with only the "complicated player" label?
Yet, there I am, every Monday at 8:00pm.
I just keep reminding myself of that one time they strongly hinted at female masturbation (Blair). That's got to count for something, right?
Haha, yeah, amidst a whole lotta POC problems, ridiculously-beyond-ridiculous classism problems, materialism, etc, there's major slut-shaming going on in that show! And Chuck Bass being basically a rapist but still being sexy- that show is soooo troubling. But I love it. Because I'm human and find it entertaining- and YES the Blair masturbation thing was pretty great, I've gotta say. Not that it makes up for anything else.
I struggle with number 5 and it's not just with male friends but female friends too. None of my other friends consider themselves as feminists all though they seem to agree with a lot of what I say. But there are many times I choose to stay quite in situations where my frame of thinking will not be appreciated. I hate being the feminist police. Once that label is put on you (which it already has been put on me) I feel that everything you say is undermined and not taken seriously. I feel like you have to choose your battles so sometimes it's best to roll your eyes and keep it moving. But I hate feeling like I've somehow betrayed my feminist values. My political views are very personal and important to me, so I choose to share usually in spaces that will appreciate my point of view even if they disagree.
When I am with other feminists (or at least people who practice feminist ideals) it is so easy for me to live like a feminist and talk about it. When I am in the presence of people who give me weird looks when I say something is sexist, I feel strange and usually shut up. I really need to feel more comfortable sharing my ideas.
The other day i was at my soon to be father-in-laws house when he mentioned that the hexagon-shaped air hockey puck was hard for women to hit. My response was "WTF makes a hexagon shape harder for women to hit!" He got a big grin on his face, because he loves to piss me off about this. He them made every sexist remark he could possibly think of over the course of the next ten minutes, smiling the whole time at me.
Then, he said I just didn't get his sense of humor. I asked him if it would be funny if I was a women of color and he made racist jokes. He said the two things weren't comparable.
Seriously, how can some people be so dense.
Anyway, like I said before, I need to speak my mind more. And not be worried about what other will say.
i have huge body image issues to the point where i often feel ashamed to be alive because i am so ugly.
related to that, i can't leave the house without makeup on my face, even if i'm just checking the mail. i don't even like to let my husband see me w/o makeup.
i will argue vehemently with anyone that a woman's size and appearance shouldn't matter but i'm not going to lie, i have cried in front of the mirror many times.
i'm a mom and i buy my daughter girly things like baby dolls and kitchen sets. she likes these things, and i have to admit, i also like my little pony and strawberry shortcake and tea parties and other girly things & it's so much fun to indulge in those "girly things". i do try to counteract that stuff with things like dump trucks, dinosaurs, remote control cars, robots, army gear toys, etc.
Don't feel bad about buying those things for your daughter! There's nothing inherently wrong with them, and you are aware enough to try to balance it out, which is (imo) what you should do.
I buy my niece girly things, too. But those are some of the things she likes, and there are plenty of other things she likes that are gender neutral or "masculine" that I buy or do with her too. I don't want her to think that "feminine" things are bad like I did (though I can see that she's already starting to pick that up, dammit).
I don't think it's a feminist parent's obligation to not buy the girly stuff for girls. Girls who grow up in our culture have been socialized to want them, and often feel left out if they can't have the toys they've been told they're supposed to want by the ads on TV. I think the better approach is to get them a variety of toys (like you do) and then talk with them about why girls are supposed to like some toys and boys are supposed to like different ones. I use the "they made a mistake" line with my 5 y/o stepdaughter. She'll say "well, Aubreanna said that Transformers are for boys" and I'll reply "yes, Aubreanna thinks that because that's what the commercials on TV say, but they just made a mistake about that. Girls and boys can play with whatever toys they choose." This totally does it for her, and gives her a non-confrontational way to respond to people who try to correct her choice of toys.
Regarding #5, I absolutely will not tolerate that from anyone I know, especially not my male friends. I'm the first to speak up about it, always. No matter how much I'd like to be "one of the guys", if it involves being a chauvinist, I'll pass. I've found that I've had a profound influence too, which feels great :)
I've been a self-proclaimed feminist ever since I've heard the word (probably before I actually understood what it meant). Like all of you, my actual life does not match up to my feminist ideals.
On the positive side, as I have gotten older (I'm in my 40s), I have become much more straight forward about expressing myself. If others don't like my opinions, it doesn't matter that much. I apologize only if I need to and don't feel bad at all. I feel like I have actually grown out of some of these "female" behaviors.
One of the best decisions I ever made was to make my husband do his own laundry. When we first married, I did his laundry but he wasn't cooperating with the sorting so I told him he could have the chore. It's been more than 20 years and I have never regretted this.
BUT:
1. I tend to let my husband drive when we're out together (and he's a terrible driver).
2. I do nearly all the housework and cooking. Most of the time, I don't mind cooking--I'm quite good at it and hunger tends to be my primary motivation (rather that the gender role issue). As for the housework, I do it but I do as little as possible. My house is clean and organized (but dusty...).
3. I wear make-up and like clothes and don't see this as a problem. But I sure would like to be thinner. I'm not that much overweight so it's not really a health concern. But yet, I'm not vain enough to stay on a diet very long.
4. I worry about aging. Even though I look pretty good for my age, I miss the male admiration that I took for granted when I was younger.
5. Re: aging--I am SOOOOO annoyed with men my own age. These men feel entitled to pursue women half their age. It's amazing. It's gotten so bad that I dodge social events when I know certain people either will bring a girl half their age OR the men bring their age- appropriate date but REALLY ADMIRE the guy with the young woman (who may not even be all that hot).
Re: #5 - Older men with younger women.
I'm a 27 year old woman with a husband 35 years older than me (he's 62). I think there is a lot of sexism involved in all of the crap that we have to deal with.
Amazingly enough, I am an adult who is allowed to make my own decisions. I can actually choose an older man because of his personality, our chemistry together, and all the other reasons that people choose their partners. And he is allowed to choose me for those same reasons. I don't have to be a golddigger or searching for a daddy figure due to mental illness or anything else. We just really fit together and have a great relationship.
And as someone who's "not that hot" (I'm significantly overweight and pretty average looking), I don't understand what my appearance has to do with justifying my husband's choice of me as a partner.
I just get very frustrated by women over 40 who seem to take serious issue with our relationship. We've gotten looks and comments from complete strangers in grocery stores and other places. My relationship is my choice and has no actual effect on any stranger's life, so people should really just get over it.
It's sexim that women feel their worth declines as they age because it's sexism that states that a woman's worth is directly related to her physical appearance. And it's sexism when women hate each other over these things. Hating on the younger woman and then insulting her appearance is buying in to rather sexist behavior.
Just as a clarification on the part about not being with my husband because I'm searching for a daddy figure due to a mental illness:
I debated with myself over how to word this or whether to include it. It bothers me when people reduce the whole of my relationship to something that would just be a symptom of an illness. But I don't want that to come across as an ableist comment. I'm not sure if that's possible. I'd welcome any constructive criticism.
I have a mental illness, so I'll comment on this if you don't mind :) I think a better way of saying that is that some people assume you're with your partner because of unresolved issues (or something along those lines) - the phrase 'unresolved issues' sounds kind of icky to me, but it's better than saying that kind of thing is an illness, because it's definitely not. People who think an age difference between partners is a symptom of an illness simply do not understand what a mental illness is.
Whoa!! Defensive much?
Go back and read my post CAREFULLY. I didn't say one critical word about the young women. Nor did I criticize adults in committed relationships.
I was criticizing 40-something men for USING young women as ARM CANDY.
Last time I saw this in a social setting, a 42 year old man brought a 19 year old girl as his date!
Don't position yourself a a "young" woman, For the type of guys I'm talking about, you're already over the hill.
I was waiting for someone to bring up "Gossip Girl".
I feel guilty every time I watch and always feel so conflicted: how the hell am I supposed to accept a character like Chuck Bass? He's a two-time attempted rapist and disturbingly emotionally abusive to Blair. How the hell am I supposed to accept Serena being labeled a "slut" when guys on the show sleep with/cheat on whoever and get away with only the "complicated player" label?
Yet, there I am, every Monday at 8:00pm.
I just keep reminding myself of that one time they strongly hinted at female masturbation (Blair). That's got to count for something, right?
I am an engineer in a automotive manufacturing plant and, thus (so far), work in an extremely male-dominated environment. Days go by in which I don't even speak to other women.
1. I let myself be interrupted frequently, but never interrupt others, even when they are talking about basketball and I have an urgent work-related concern. I tell myself it is politeness, but letting it happen validates that men's concerns are more important than mine.
2. I flirt to get my way. Not a lot, but a little. Everybody likes to be flirted with and most of the older men (as in, could be my grandfather older) will do anything if you smile and giggle at them a little.
3. I let the racist, classist, homophobic comments slide too much. I've grown (from neccessity, often) strong enough to call people on the sexist sh*t but I live in Alabama and the other stuff is exhausting.
4. I get to involved with other people's problems. I feel compelled to be empathetic to the guys at the office and they take advantage and dump their frustrating projects on me.
Could be worse. I'm still trying to find the balance where I can be a woman, but not the subject of sexual conquest or a nagging wife-figure. Its a surprisingly thin line. Although when you think about it all those nagging wives were once sexy, exciting romantic pursuits.
Thank you all for posting about this! It's something I constantly struggle with, all the time.
When I hang out with guys and hear them say sexists things, sometimes I say stuff, sometimes I don't. But I always feel guilty when I don't.
When I put on makeup I think about the fact the it's only because I am a lady and that pisses me off, but I put it on anyway because I want to feel pretty.
I feel crappy about myself because I think that guys don't hit on me as much as they used to. I hate that I care.
When I shave my legs I also think about how I'm only doing it because society tells me to, but AGAIN I do it anyway because I'm afraid of what people will think.
There was a photo of Madonna in the 80s I think, or maybe earlier,that was recently put on Ebay and she was naked and hairy. Everywhere. Armpits, legs, everything. Completely natural.
I felt empowered by her, to know that she doesn't give two fucks about what people think of her.
A lot of women shamed Madonna, and were disgusted, as well as men.
I can't help but envy her, but at the same time I would never want people to think those things about me, and I struggle with this idea.
Are we all that self conscious? I don't understand why all these amazing feminists are just as insecure as me, I thought I was one of the few, not one of the many.
It just shows how deeply rooted sexism is in us, and how hard it is to fight it no matter how long or or passionate you are about feminism.
I thank people when really they should be thanking me. Then I ask myself, "why did I just say 'thank you?'"
Can we have a thread where we talk about what's improved in the past year(s) in this regard? What has feminism done for our personal life? I'd love to comment on that. I'm sure there are things in my personal life that don't jive with my feminist ideals but nothing that bothers me on a daily basis. I like to think of the positives. :)
I've been really lazy lately about not correcting people when they rave endlessly about how beautiful my daughter and stepdaughter are. It's true that they're gorgeous girls (in my totally unbiased opinion) but I really want them to get the message that this is not the most important thing about them. I used to be really good about saying something like "they're really smart and strong too" or countering the endless princess comments with "no, they're real girls." But lately I'm tired and in a hurry and am sick to death of living in a small town where everything you say gets repeated and gossiped about ad nauseam, and I just long for the comfy anonymity of the city sometimes!
OK, rant over. I will resume being religious about my responses, because my girls need to hear it, even if it has no effect on the well-meaning adults who are inflicting these antiquated ideas on them.
My mother was absolutely diligent about that, and it wasn't until a few years ago (I'm 34), that my mother told me I was pretty. I went through childhood thinking I was ugly because my mother never called me beautiful.
I remember a teacher I had in the 8th grade asked us all to write down four words to describe ourselves. They we all read the words aloud, and she said, "Kathy is the only girl who didn't use a word to describe her physical appearance. Earl is the only boy who did," and launched into a discussion of how boys and girls were taught to think of themselves. In retrospect, that was totally awesome on the teacher's part, but all I remember is being on the verge of tears because I suddenly 'knew' that everyone was aware even I didn't consider myself pretty.
Which means that despite the efforts of my mother and teacher, I'd still internalized the idea that being pretty was a major determiner of self-worth for girls and trashed myself endlessly because I didn't think I had any prettiness about me. Plus, I was the official "smart girl" in my school, and that was definitely a polite way of saying, "not pretty" in my head.
I was SHOCKED to come across a picture of myself at 13 just a few weeks ago. I look completely and totally normal, and yes, pretty cute. I can't believe I genuinely thought I was unattractive back then.
Oh, and I'm not saying that you never say your kids are pretty! My point is that I internalized all this beauty shit despite what I was trying to be taught. It's out there in our society, unfortunately.
I know, and it drives me crazy. The commercials that are aimed at girls on children's tv shows are horrible, to start with. So I openly talk with them about how there are many people, stories they hear, kids movies, etc that act like being pretty is the most important thing for a girl. My stepdaughter is 5, and very interested in the concept of making a mistake, so I just say "they just made a mistake, that's all" whenever we talk about someone or something that assumes this. She totally gets it and is fascinated by the concept that an adult can make a mistake. I can't wait until she patiently explains to an adult that they made a mistake by thinking that it's so important for girls to be pretty. I hope I'm there to see it! My daughter is only 15 mos, so it's a little early for her.
I tend to expect other people to read my mind and know what I want, which is annoying because it's a quality I would interpret as a sexist stereotype in a female character, or when other people talk about women who do the same thing. I need to keep speaking up about what I want and need and expect from other people, and I need to remember that most of the people I interact with care about me and want me to be happy.
Ditto, but its because I don't want to feel ~naggy~
Me too! The worst is that I've tried to break out of it lately and have been saying exactly what I mean as much as possible but my SO is so used to it, he still thinks I'm trying to imply something else. Then it becomes this huge fight because I'm trying to get him to hear what I actually mean while he thinks he is hearing it already.
Luckily, I think we've reached a point where we know we just have to be patient with each other about it, and listen carefully to each other.
I know next to nothing about beauty and fashion. I'm hopeless with it and I know it. I look bad most of the time and I'm constantly feeling torn between depression about my appearance and anger that it shouldn't matter and feeling like buying expensive makeup or fashionable clothes is anti-feminist or shallow. I think the fear of being seen as shallow is what has lead me to become nearly 30 and still not know how to put on makeup without looking ridiculous. 2 days ago after having an allergic reaction to my latest attempt at concealer I went to a make up store in hopes of getting some help. Apparently I my appearance deemed me as unworthy of the sale's persons help. Its a no win.
I don't know if this will help you, but I like to look good simply because it makes me feel good about myself. I don't dress up for anyone but me - okay, that's not entirely true, but even when I do it for other people, I am pleasantly aware of the fact that it improves my own feelings about myself more than it does anything for that person.
And I don't wear makeup. I tried to for a few years but got sick of having it constantly melting off my face and not being able to touch my own face at all. But I noticed that the only reason anyone treated me any differently when I wore it was because I stood up straighter, walked more confidently, and looked people in the eye. So now I just try to do that without makeup, and it seems to work perfectly. I didn't wear any makeup when I met my SO and the very mention of me possibly wearing it kind of grosses him out, so it is possible to look good and be loved without makeup.
I hope this helps!
I was an armpit shaver for most of my life, from about 12 or so until about 34. For years I hated it. The time, effort and cost, not to mention the constant skin irritation. A couple of years ago I stopped shaving them. Yay! What annoys me is that part of why I allowed myself to abandon this unnecessary practice was the fact that my husband approved of said abandonment. I love the fact that he doesn't view shaving as necessary for "proper womanhood" or some such bullshit, but I hate the fact that I clearly felt at least some need for his approval before I was able to give myself permission to cease doing something I always hated, resented and physically (if only minorly) suffered from.
Damn the insidious, internalized patriarchy!!!
I literally only last night let the boyfriend see my vulva in it's partially natural state. I normally only shave part of it anyway but I was so ashamed for so long that he might possibly feel even the slightest stubble. Turns out he doesn't really care either way :p It really frustrates me when I find these parts in me that have been engrained, even when I consider myself fairly enlightened about feminism.
thank porn for those ideas!
I used to be like that. It took like a year of being with my boyfriend to let him see my vulva without being shaved. But ex boyfriends probably never saw it without being shaved. I'd refuse sex if it wasn't shaved to my liking. SIGH
Just had to poke my head out of the murky lurk to say you are completely right that #4 is a gendered issue! I was just having a conversation today with several girlfriends about that exact problem.
I also see all the women I do martial arts with have a lot of problems with #1.
I think the way we approach math is definitely a gendered issue. When I tutored middle-schoolers, it was always the girls who had the lowest confidence in the subject. And even though I did well in math classes and tutored basic math, I always felt I was pretty mediocre at it until recently. Then, I started using a lot of math in my job and realized that I'm actually pretty good at math. In fact, I just scored a 790 on the quantitative section of the GRE! So to all the ladies out there who think they can't do math, I'm here to tell you you're probably wrong. All it takes is a little confidence and practice!
Ugh that was supposed to be a reply to Courtney.
i've always been absolutely terrible at math. i remember crying in 4th grade trying to understand long division... i never thought of it as a gender thing, i think i'm personally just really not very smart lol
But I think we underestimate the degree to which kids absorb the unspoken cultural attitudes toward them. Even if there was never a time when you remember someone shaming you or making you feel like you weren't good at math, the attitudes of our culture saturate parent's attitudes, the way teachers interact with students, etc. All you need to prove this is to look at girls vs. boys scores on standardized math tests in cultures where it's assumed that boys are better at math vs. countries where it's assumed that girls are better. The scores predictably follow the cultural expectations. Every time.
Everyone has different strengths and weaknesses, of course, but I bet my bottom dollar you're better at math than you think.
Everyone has different strengths and weaknesses, of course, but I bet my bottom dollar you're better at math than you think.
I think I kinda of....let my feminist guard down a lot, even if that isn't the best phrasing. I mean, it's ok not to be vehemant and killjoyish all the time, sure, but sometimes I see a commercial and it takes me a few days, or a post on feministing, to open my eyes and wonder what I was thinking when I saw it, and how i could've missed it...
I have 4 feminist transgressions, I think.
1) I diligently count calories.
2) Counting them is actually kind of amazing, as I'm pretty much innummerate
3) I do like some things that would be regarded as sexist. Robert Crumb comics come to mind.
4) I'm mentally ill and can be kind of self-destructive. Although this in itself shouldn't be shameful and I feel strongly about removing the social stigma and misinformation in our culture. But I also feel like--well, there's this feminist ideal of the strong smart competent woman who can handle every problem, is always in control and always knows what to do, and the illness gets in the way of me being that feminist.
I hear you. I'm bipolar and I'm on Weight Watchers, so I self-destruct and log every bite I eat on my computer :)
The mental illness thing is HUGE for me. We're a long, long way from the day when 'normal' people are conscious of how isolating the illnesses themselves are, let alone how bad it feels to be depressed/manic/suicidal/psychotic/etc. and then ON TOP OF HOW BAD THAT FEELS, have people constantly make hurtful comments and produce media that perpetuate the ideas that mentally ill people are best avoided because we are incorrigible, lazy, scary, automatically always dangerous, shouldn't have children, all need straight jackets lest we smear shit on the wall, and on and on and on.
And calling people on saying/doing offensive things of that nature can lead to being fired because it is assumed you will be less able to do your job, friends suddenly avoiding you because you are now a 'crazy' person to them, people not wanting to date you, etc. I stay in my rather small, suffocating closet most of the time because the social consequences of admitting you're mentally ill to the wrong person are so dire.
And since I've gotten used to keeping my mouth shut about those things, it gets a little easier to let sexist/racist/heterosexist, etc. comments slide because I've trained myself to think, "OMG, I Can't. Say. Anything. Or. I. Will. Pay."
1. I want to loose weight really quick by dieting. I keep obsessing about diet pills. I haven't bought any but the temptation is huge.
2. I hate my stretch marks. It makes me angry that when I go to the beach (and I go to the nuddie beach) I look like a zebra.
3. I buy lots of creams. For my face. My body. My legs. My hands. I know I could probably do with only one cream but I am cream-obsessed and every time a new one comes out I want to try it.
4. Sometimes, when people say I'm pretty I think they lie or are forced out of courtesy.
5. I'm afraid of growing old and loosing my looks. I think my youth is what makes me most attractive to others.
My biggest feminist transgression is my body image. No matter how many times I tell myself that the ideal of beauty in unattainable I feel ugly and inadequate. No matter how many times I remind myself that being overweight (even just a little bit) doesn't mean I'm a lazy pig or ugly, I still feel that way. I also obsess over body hair removal and feel dirty if I don't shave, even though I know being hairless is just another patriarchal ideal. It's so frustrating that I let things like this bother me even though I know better. I spend all this time learning and preaching that the standards of beauty are wrong and that women of all sizes, shapes, color, etc, are beautiful, but I still fall into the whole "I'm fat and ugly" mode of thinking.
1. I try really hard not to apologize all the time, but I swear it just comes out of my mouth and I can't stop it.
2. I really believe that shaving your arms, legs, and pubic hair is completely unnecessary and infantilizes women. But I do it anyway. Not really because I am trying to impress anyone, but because I don't like having body hair, I think it is annoying.
But . . . I am 6 months pregnant, and I can't actually see my vagina anymore. That makes it almost impossible to shave. Maybe this will break me of my passion for shaving :)
1. Feeling like i'm gross if I haven't shaved/waxed. I'd never judge someone *else* on that but I always judge myself.
2. Seeing a really pretty, thin young woman and having a gut instinct of "she's probably a bitch/stupid/superficial" before my intellect kicks in and says "why should she be?"
It's hard. some things are so ingrained that it's really hard work to change your thinking.
I agree that the five points above exist for women, but not for me. I think i'm pretty hot, good looking and thin. I'm an engineer and don't feel stupid, and actually think I'm smarter than most of my guy friends. I don't apologize for much, except when I'm actually wrong. I never wear makeup. But I still have some feminist confessions, so here goes:
1. As an engineer I am expected to make a lot of money. This has ended up becoming a joke between me and my boyfriend, I have a masters and am more educated than him, I'll make more money and he'll be a stay at home dad (which is a joke, cause i don't think either of us wants kids), but now i'm pursuing a non-profit career in environmentalism, so i'm not going to be making more than him, and i have this nagging feeling that it's because of the joke that it ended up becoming this way.
2. I do the cooking and cleaning. I always feel like it's because of different circumstances that makes it this way; he works extreme hours and i work normal hours, i'm a good cook etc. but is it just excuses?
3. I most often react when people say sexist/homophobic/heteronormative/racist things, but sometimes I get so upset I start fighting and crying and storm out of the room. Which makes those people be able to say "women are so emotional, can't have a real discussion" etc. that sucks
4. I don't shave anywhere. Have massively hairy armpits and legs :) and I like it that way, I like telling people that I don't shave, to make them realize that "normal" people also don't shave. BUT! I never show it. I don't wear tank tops and feel uncomfortable when people stare at my hairy legs.
chi- kudos on your environmentalist job.
I am also an engineer out-earning my SO. He's more educated, but teaches so he makes (practically) no money. We always say that he will stay home with the kids, but it isn't a joke. Even if you never intend to have children, the idea of "Mr. Mom" shouldn't be seen as ridiculous.
My dad took over the majority of the household chores and child-rearing when my mom went back to school and I wouldn't trade anything for that time spent with my dad. He wasn't emasculated doing "women's work" he was just being a good father. When my mom graduated she started working full-time and my parents had a very egaltarian household. (Extremely so, chores weren't split 50/50 but four ways to include my sis and I.)
I'm afraid to speak up about sexism when I am in a group. I fear violence and/or ridicule.
The last time I suffered the "women in the kitchen" problem was with my ex-husband and the couples we hung around with. I spoke up about it and the men just laughed it off.
-The hypocrisy of my eating disorder.
-I'm math-phobic, but this started way back in kindergarten, before any awareness of science/gender binary discrimination. My parents never would have inhibited me either, especially at such an early age.
-I'm sometimes sexist at work. I'm a supervisor at a locally owned coffeeshop, and I tend to train new female staff more verbally, whereas I show the men through repeated actions ("Now you do it").
Also I tend to assume the customer service position more frequently when I have a male staffer with me. If I have a female subordinate, she uses the cash register while I build drinks. That's because she tends to be more pleasant than I am, and I just prefer to not interact with the customers. Secondly, when I'm with a male coworker, it tends to either be J or C. J is experienced, likes to make drinks, he's fast, and he's good at it. C is new, and needs practice at making them anyways.
Either way, I need to be more egalitarian at work.
I'm math-phobic, but this started way back in kindergarten, before any awareness of science/gender binary discrimination
According to the studies I've read in Soc and Ed journals, the way parents, pre-school, and kindergarten teachers interact with students is deeply gendered regarding math. In hidden camera studies, there's a great deal of differential treatment for boys vs. girls both in time spent with them in class when working on math/science, and in body language and facial expressions. I think kids really pick up on this stuff whether they're aware of it or not.
Oh, I don't doubt that at all. The ironic thing about this is that my parents deeply encouraged math with me. My dad got really frustrated: "Counting is so much easier than reading!" He didn't see how I could read chapter books before I could count to 100.
I feel the same as you do in regards to your #5. I feel as though I want to enlighten my friends (who don't identify as feminist) in hopes that they will appreciate and respect my feminist ideals. That said, I don't want to be the "feminist police" all the time and constantly pick fights to the point where we are no longer having fun. As a young feminist coming into her own, this is something I struggle with every time I exit my "feminist circle."
5. My feminist boyfriend (of 5 years) and I struggle with this a lot. I feel that if someone says something sexist, racist, etc that I should always say something. Usually if I don't know the person well or it's a work situation I just say something like, "That comment makes me feel uncomfortable" or "I think that's an inappropriate thing to say" or "Can you not use that word around me".
He thinks that his approach of not laughing or sometimes leaving the room is good enough, and that he doesn't want to be seen as "uncool". He says that he likes to slowly build up a friendship and earn respect before saying something, but I think it's just a cop out, so he can remain "one of the boys" at work and with his friends.
It really frustrates me and has put stress on our relationship.
It's helpful to see that a lot of my fellow feminists struggle with the same thing. I should try to be more patient with him as he learns how to confront oppressive remarks.
I'm a little late commenting on this one because our internet has been down, but I think it's a great topic and I've really enjoyed reading everyone's responses. I also believe it's a pretty cathartic exercise- yes we're feminists but *gasp* we're not "flawless"!
Here's my list:
1. I grew up in a family of several very sexist, misogynists men, who will blurt out "scientific evidence" that women are biologically stupider than men, who shamelessly verbally objectify women constantly, who don't do dishes, who always drive, who think they are entitled to sex with lot's of younger beautiful women and will use money to get it if they have to etc. and it's gotten to the point where most of the time I keep my mouth shut and roll my eyes because it's too exhausting and frustrating to try and argue.
2. I wear make up when I work as a waitress in the belief that it might up my tips just a little bit.
3. I am definitely a right brained thinker, with my strengths lying in intuition, compassion, creativity, and conflict resolution as opposed to remembering facts, names, dates, or being able to problem solve in math, and I often wish I had more of the latter going on so that I could spit out historic facts and names to back up my feminist stances on issues.
4. This might be more of a LGBT issue than a feminist one, but I still haven't told a good portion of my family that I have a girlfriend.
5. I use some words that I know come from oppressive/offensive/sexist/racist roots, and I don't always feel like calling out my friends when they use language that is so blatantly out of context because I know they don't *mean it*. Whereas coming from a stranger I would get offended.
The worst thing I do is pay more attention to men. If a woman is speaking and then a man starts to talk - even if he's talking to someone else entirely - I stop paying attention to what she's saying and start listening to him. I defer to my husband a lot too, mostly because I'm shy around people I don't know that well but it still bothers me that I do it and I've been trying to change it.
I also have a very hard time speaking up about the sexism/racism, etc. that I see. Part of it is that I'm still not always sure if what I'm seeing actually is what I think it is; part of it is that I'm still not even sure if saying something will help that much or if the things I see are even all that important in the grand scheme of things; part of it is that I was raised in an abusive home where you just never said that kind of thing because it would lead to a confrontation and confrontation meant the threat of physical violence (even though actual physical violence didn't happen that often); part of it is that I'm afraid it will mean that no one will love me, and since I don't have a wonderful family to fall back on like so many other people do, I really do need the support of the people I've accumulated in my life, even if they are sexist or racist. And all of these excuses make me angry with myself for making excuses.
I got sick of watching my husband gag and wretch violently, so I let him off the hook on diaper changing.
He used to joke with our friends about how he was physically unable to change diapers, but I found it so humiliating, I finally told him to NEVER EVER EVER tell another person that he didn't have to change diapers.
Sounds like a conversation I've had with my SO.
Him: "I'm never changing any diapers."
Me: "So who's going to do it then?"
Him: "You used to change your little brother's diapers all the time!" (the implication being that this means I'm not grossed out by it so I should be the one who has to do it)
Me: "Yeah, and that's why you should do it. I've already done more than my fair share."
I'd like to think that we would actually share if we ever had a kid, but I really wouldn't be surprised if it ended up for us the same way it has with you and your SO.
Courtney, Math is really 40% skill and 60% confidence. so take a deep breath and ask for the check (with authority) and if you make a mistake who cares?!
by the way, adding, subtracting, and dividing are not really a measure of how much math you know:) I suck at subtracting numbers in my head but I can prove a mathematical theorem faster than most. I have kicked many asses in graduate math classes.
so, screw addition :)
This is another one that I have trouble with, that may be a generational thing and not necessarily a sex thing (it also may be TMI for some people), but I CANNOT go crap in a public restroom. I also can't crap in other people's houses. I can burp in front of anyone, but I just cannot fart. Especially in front of guys, oh lord.
My boyfriend has no trouble with this. And countless other men I know.
I hate that I still care what my ass looks like in jeans.
I'm so there on #5.
There are ten people in my class, and I'm the only girl. So I often let objectifying stuff from the guys slide, because I don't want to sacrifice my position as "one of the guys" - I spend 45 hours a week with these guys, I don't want them to think I'm a bitch, and we're not close enough friends for rebuking them to be seen as anything but.
Also, I apologize a lot. But I have a suspicion that this has more to do with being Canadian than it does being female, because I know my brother and my dad do it too. Although my family still laughs - once I was sleeping on a bench in Heathrow after a completely exhausting travel ordeal, and a lady ran into the bench with her wheelchair. My groggy response? "Sorry, ma'am" and an attempt to move out of her way, before falling back to sleep. My mum and brother politely waited for her to leave before laughing at me.
1. Weight has always been a big issue for me, and recently I found myself upset that no one had commented on how thin I was lately, and was wondering if this was because I was getting "fat." I have always been really thin and even though I recognize how fucked up it is that my weight has been the focus of most of the positive attention I have received in my life, I still play into it.
2. I don't speak up when a friend of mine makes racist comments. The potential awkwardness of calling her out in front of our friends silences me, even though her comments make me really uncomfortable. I also don't call out my lesbian friends when they use "gay" or "homosexual" as a bad thing. I am quick to correct my straight friends for the same offense, but I let it slip with my gay friends for some reason.
3. I definitely apologize and use qualifiers like "I think" too much. Especially in my papers for school, I find that I an constantly using qualifiers like that to justify my points, but I am making a conscious effort to only use them when it's really appropriate!
4. I very rarely speak up in class for fear that I will sound stupid or my point will be ridiculed.
5. I'm not as fully- feministy as I would like to be around certain friends because I feel like they don't understand or would get annoyed by it. It's weird to think that I suppress such a large part of who I am and what I am passionate about to make other people more comfortable.
Wow, typing all that out was pretty therapeutic!
I’m coming to terms with the fact that I have a severe case of math anxiety. I didn’t think such a thing was real until I realized that my physical responses to a simple math test--sweating, raised heart rate, feeling chocked, etc.--were the physical responses of fear. I cry almost every day in math class, and while it’s absolutely humiliating I cannot stop. I’ve thought very seriously about hurting myself because I “need to be punished” for such incompetence. This is, obviously, really fucking bad. I feel even more ashamed because this does not live up to my feminist ideals.
When I fail or struggle, I can just picture myself looking like a great statistic for some conservative organization to go “You’re bad at math because you’re a girl! You cry over it because you’re a girl!” Proponents of sex-segregated education say that girls are better at “story problems”, also known as “word problems” or “the bane of nearly every math student’s existence”. I feel like shit because I am much better at word problems! But I seem to be the only one. Everyone, male and female, dreads them.
Basically, I not only feel like a worthless moron, I feel like I’m a failure as a feminist. It’s like I might as well be the Barbie that said “Math is hard!”
I used to cry doing my calculus homework every single night, and during most of my tests for that class. I was OK at math in earlier/easier classes (but definitely by no means confident then).
And I went to an all-girls high school, so there was no gendered bullshit *in my high school.*
But I had definitely grown up hearing 'math is harder for girls' and 'boys are better at math' from the time I was 8 years old. I heard this from my father, from books, and from teachers. By the time I got to higher math in high school, it was a bit too late for me. I had already internalized the gender bias long before then.
Wow! This is very fascinating. It sounds like I am a bit older than many of you - I'm 58. I didn't know women were expected to shave their pubes now. I'm sure glad I dodged that bullet! One thing I see that hasn't seemed to change though is our feeling the need to be thin and attractive. I struggle with the getting old thing and not being attractive to men anymore. I wonder sometimes if I should have some work done on myself. I know I never will, but I think about it. And then I feel like slapping myself! But it's a process - I accept it more as time goes by. You have to - what else can you do? In a way it frees me up, not having to worry about the male attention. And I speak up more now. If people don't like it, they can just think I'm a crazy old lady - I don't care. I guess there are certain benefits to getting older. To all you younger women out there - don't let the assholes get you down.
I was 22 or 23 when I found out we were 'supposed to' shave or at least shave our pubes (I'm 34). It was a guy that told me. He was 30.
I always call bullshit on girls/women who claim they do it for themselves or that they've 'always been uncomfortable with hair down there.' I've heard 16-year-olds say that.
That cannot possibly be true, because when I was in high school, NO ONE shaved their pubes (I saw evidence of this in the locker room) except porn stars. How on earth could countless teenage and 20-something girls all of a sudden decide for themselves that pubic hair was gross? It's just as much due to social conditioning as armpit and leg shaving.
As for me? I totally cave to social pressure to shave my armpits - It feels gross to have pit hair even though I KNOW I've been taught that by my culture. I've gone through phases where I didn't shave my legs, but that's because no one ever saw them. I don't trim my pubic hair at all unless I'm dating/having sex with a man, but I do trim when I am because I'm afraid I'll be rejected if I don't.
I refuse to shave down there, though. The thought of stubble and razor burn, etc. scares me, and no way in HELL I'm yanking it all out with wax.
All of which are just excuses, given that I do remove most of the hair with beard-trimming scissors anyway. And I only do that when I'm into a man, and not when I'm into a woman. (In that vein, it would be interesting to hear from other bi women and lesbian women about their hair-removing (or lack thereof) with respect to when/if they have sexual partners).
I think I do have to remember that even if hair removal is because of social pressure, social pressure is REAL pressure, so it's really, really hard not to cave into it. We live in society, not vaccuums.
Whoops! That first sentence should say we were 'supposed to' shave or at least trim our pubes.
1. There is an older man (not a lot, but he's 27 and I'm 20) in my classes who talks to me like a little girl and it makes me very uncomfortable. I stopped defending myself against him when everyone laughed and called me angry like they thought I was just trying to be cute.
2. In the same vein, in my economics classes, I let people (almost always men. no, make that always) interrupt me who do not raise their hands. When I get the nerve to not wait my turn, I do still use qualifiers or the question-y voice inflection.
3. I say "I'm sorry" A LOT. A LOT. Even when I don't hear what someone says, I say "I'm sorry?" If I walk within a mile of someone's path
4. I say "sorry" when I don't understand something in class.
5. I compare myself to every other girl ever. When in certain social situations where I am supposed to put on appearances for one reason or another, I find myself tugging at my shirt or messing with my hair to try to make myself look more like the girl standing next to me.
1. There is an older man (not a lot, but he's 27 and I'm 20) in my classes who talks to me like a little girl and it makes me very uncomfortable. I stopped defending myself against him when everyone laughed and called me angry like they thought I was just trying to be cute.
2. In the same vein, in my economics classes, I let people (almost always men. no, make that always) interrupt me who do not raise their hands. When I get the nerve to not wait my turn, I do still use qualifiers or the question-y voice inflection.
3. I say "I'm sorry" A LOT. A LOT. Even when I don't hear what someone says, I say "I'm sorry?" If I walk within a mile of someone's path
4. I say "sorry" when I don't understand something in class.
5. I compare myself to every other girl ever. When in certain social situations where I am supposed to put on appearances for one reason or another, I find myself tugging at my shirt or messing with my hair to try to make myself look more like the girl standing next to me.
I hate the interrupting thing. I'm getting better at not letting the interruptions slide, normally interrupting the interrupter with, "Excuse me, did it sound like I was finished?" It's bitchy, but guys are often a little embarrassed when they get called on their rudeness. Plus asserting that you value your own opinion makes it easier for others to respect your opinion. If you don't care about what you are saying, why should they?
This is my first post here, though I've been lurking for a bit.
As a girl going to a very science and technology focused university that's about 3/4 male, I haven't really had to deal with 2. My feminist failures to live up to my ideals:
1. Shaving stuff: I enjoy having my pubes shaved/trimmed, even though it's hard to maintain, because it makes that area more sensitive and makes self-stimulation more interesting. On the other hand, I dislike shaving my legs/pits but see them as dirty/unclean/nasty when they aren't shaved. I know it's a socially ingrained thing and there's nothing wrong with going out in clothing that reveals unshaved body parts (especially in summer), but it's something I find myself unable to do. Wearing jeans in hot weather because I'm nearsighted and clumsy and leg-shaving is a bother is something I wish I didn't do.
2. Equating masculinity with power. I feel more confident/expect to be taken more seriously in suits/jeans/androgynous clothing, to the point where I would never have worn girly things or nail polish in high school because I felt the need to seem "tough" there, and I equated femininity as weakness. I'm getting a bit better on this, in part because I'm tired of avoiding certain types of attire that are typical of young women (skinny jeans, pastel colors, etc.) because I couldn't risk being seen as "cute" or "weak." I haven't quite reached the point of wearing pink in public, and I still feel nervous wearing skirts, but I do it sometimes.
3. @5: I'm bad at dealing with sexual objectification. Given the comments I've made to guy friends about how certain male bodies look, I feel like I have no right to challenge their comments on female bodies. I take issue with reducing a person to their parts, as it were, but I'm guilty of discussing individuals in terms of their attractiveness often enough that I don't feel I can condemn that act in others. I'm comfortable calling people on racism/homophobia/heteronormativity/forms of sexism other than objectification, because I see those things as wrong and don't participate in them. I'm just beginning to become aware of own ableist assumptions/biases, but don't think that I can honestly raise that issue with others, either.