Did anyone else see the button on someone in the crowd that said Sarah Palin: Hottest VP.

Bit condescending, eh?

what's with the children raising children image with her youngest daughter tending the baby? Do they think if they have a grade-schooler holding a baby it will make teen motherhood seem like a snap?

Perhaps it's presumptuous...but it seems accurate to me. I didn't mean to fall in love...but I did.

It makes me sick that all the Republicans (and some Democrats) are saying that we shouldn't bring her children into the debate... that we can't criticize her daughter's pregnancy. And then she goes and totally uses her special-needs child as a political tool. What a hypocrite.

yeah, you can save a lot of money when you do things like cut support for single mothers...

It's funny that both Palin and Giuliani will insult and dismiss and laugh at the concept of community organizing, and then the Republicans turn around and call Obama the elitist.

teen mothers, that is:
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/the-trail/2008/09/02/palin_slashed_funding_to_help.html

Wow, first thing I notice is how bitter the GOP seems to be. I mean, Obama went after McCain, but I feel it wasn't nearly as snarky or snide or as bush league (anyone know where that term comes from, btw? is it a vagina reference???) as the GOP speakers are. The Dems had such a positive message, this is a very stark contrast. Not that I should be surprised...

And I've also noticed that the crowd's cheering seems a just a bit forced--not very spontaneous. Like when Guliani or Pailin pauses, they kind of look at each other like, "am I supposed to cheer now?" before screaming "drill, baby, drill" or a good ole fashioned "U.S.A." chant.

Regarding Pailin, I'm not impressed. Granted, I don't like her politics, so I don't want to be impressed, but I don't think she's a strong speaker.

And also, I find her voice annoying. I know, I know, a bunch of asshat commentators said that about Hillary too. But it's not because I'm hearing "take out the garbage." Maybe it's my Boston eardrums encountering her strong pronunciation of Rs, but she sounds like the school secretary in Ferris Bueller.

She's a very good speaker. But if she reaches a higher place in government than Hillary, I'll fall into a deep depression. No one could have pushed me farther and more swiftly toward Obama than this woman, even though I know that wasn't the plan.

As an aside, I always think Cindy McCain looks freakish, and tonight is no exception.

damn my spelling is bad

sorry about that, past my bedtime

So right after Palin discussed how she as a woman was opening doors that in the past had been closed to women she compared herself to a dog. She said that the only difference between hockey moms and pitbulls are that the moms wear lipstick.

Palin is the perfect candidate because she looks nice and is a young woman who could possibly represent a younger generation of women. But what she really represents are women hating policies.

Y'know, if Palin has to drop out of the race because of any scandal or anything in her personal life, I have a pet goldfish that could totally fill in for her.

The buttons people were wearing declaring Palin the "hottest VP" are really disgusting.

But I can't believe how nasty some of her comments are, such as saying that terrorists are running wild and all Obama is concerned with is reading them their rights. THAT'S WHAT AMERICA IS BUILT ON!

And I want to vomit every time she calls McCain a "maverick."

Overall, not a very good speech.

95 million tax dollars spent on defense of her "troopergate", yeah, she knows how to not spend taxes hurr hurr

I am an undecided voter but hearing Palin speak this evening, I will vote for Obama. I had to turn off the TV, it was so insulting to woman. This is not the party I want to run the country.

All Palin's speech is doing is getting me MOTIVATED. I stopped by my local Democratic headquarters after work today to sign up for volunteering. I almost cried when I went in, seeing the quiet determination of an exceptionally diverse group of people cheerfully working together - women, men, all different ages, colors and creeds. It's what the U.S. is all about. I'm going to phone bank tomorrow night, and then after that it's voter registration around town, at the county fair, and at my local college campuses. You don't have to have $$ to donate - even an hour or two makes a big difference.

Friends, let's get to work!

A few points:

-I am particularly grossed out by her scoffing at Obama's concern that alleged terrorists are read their rights. She is mocking one of the most important aspects of our legal system; that anyone arrested MUST be promptly made aware of their rights, charged and given due process. She thinks it's laughable. That is terrifying. The crowd seemed to agree, which is also scary. Kind of makes me think about all the illegal arrests of journalists and protesters that are going on right outside of the convention.

-does anyone else feel that she is only addressing the richest people in the country? talk about elitist.

-she is grossly misrepresenting the Dem's stances. she said they weren't interested in pursuing ending the dependence on foreign oil.

-the crowd participation stuff is often orchestrated by the party, and some of it is pretty weird. "drill baby drill" chants and "hottest VP" buttons are pretty off-putting.

I've never watched something so depressing in my life.

I know this is going to sound cliche. So just go ahead and kill me. But if you muted Obamas speech and just scanned the crowds...just looking at peoples faces, I felt moved and happy and like people believed in something that was good for EVERYONE. I saw whites and Blacks and Asians and Mexicans and gay couples and straight couples and interracial couples and afros and short crops and just so damn much.

When I looked in the crowd of the RNC I just saw...happy contented faces as well...and I was looking at people that believed in something as well...but beneficial to THEM. Does that make any sense. Republican values stifle and silence so many people in America. It just felt so dry and lathargic. And then she said something about challenging the norms and making the country better than its found...whhhaaatt? You want to dig a grave for equality and call it American Values!

And I hate that she was just so...let me make sure I stress I am a woman. And I found it very condescending for Guillani (always spell that mans name wrong) to say..."No one would say that about a man" when he addressed people saying she cant do v.p and have a sick child. And oh didnt she use his ass for political reasons.

And I am sorry...when all your party does is stress moral highness and "american values" I am going to need you to adhere to them and when you dont and theres flaws in your American Value teaching system...my ass is going to be right there to tell you.

I just looked into that crowd AND THIS MAY SOUND SO WRONG...but all I saw was a bunch of people that thought gays were going to hell and shouldnt have the right to marry and enjoy benefits of marriage, and that woman should stay in the home or work but not be paid the same...and people that want to take the right of freedom of religion away and just dip the constitution in holy oil and seal it...and people that think racism dont exist and...just so many things..I saw that shit in MANY of those peoples eyes. I saw women that just wanted to vote for Palin because she has a vagina and has a son that plays hockey. I mean. What about me! What about my woman self? My woman gay self? Where is my place in your party. God. I mean. I just feel so much.

A few points:

-I am particularly grossed out by her scoffing at Obama's concern that alleged terrorists are read their rights. She is mocking one of the most important aspects of our legal system; that anyone arrested MUST be promptly made aware of their rights, charged and given due process. She thinks it's laughable. That is terrifying. The crowd seemed to agree, which is also scary. Kind of makes me think about all the illegal arrests of journalists and protesters that are going on right outside of the convention.

-does anyone else feel that she is only addressing the richest people in the country? talk about elitist.

-she is grossly misrepresenting the Dem's stances. she said they weren't interested in pursuing ending the dependence on foreign oil.

-the crowd participation stuff is often orchestrated by the party, and some of it is pretty weird. "drill baby drill" chants and "hottest VP" buttons are pretty off-putting.

wickedwench, bush league comes from a term for lower level baseball teams in the minor league, called "bush leagues" which is why a terrible play in baseball is called "bush league". It's not a misogynist term, no worries.

Ladybug, I could not agree with you more. I was a staunch Hillary supporter who was debating not voting out of principle (I live in NY and we're about as likely to go Red in November as Mass). After 3 hours of seeing the kind of hypocritical, ignorant, opportunistic and downright scary America we would have to look forward to should McCain and his trophy VP win, the Republicans have shown me that every vote counts, and they all must count toward Obama. Also, I think that any Hillary supporter who would actually vote for McCain should be ashamed of themselves. If they had any respect for Hillary and what she stood for outside of the fact that he had two X chromosomes, the idea of voting for Palin would make them sick.

I'm rather underwhelmed by Palin. As much as I'd love to see a woman in the White House, I want it to be the right woman. I don't feel she is even close. Obama/Biden '08.

a.) Is she from MN with that accent or...? I am lost.

b.) How comforting that, should she be elected into office, the only thing that differentiates her from a dog is makeup. (Let's see how many offensive gender binaries we can draw out of that one.)

c.) The baby-passing was priceless, Jessica. I especially enjoyed Cindy McCain with the baby. Also, why did her husband give the baby to the next oldest child when she was talking about him? Was it because he KNEW he was going to be on camera? Still lost.

d.) HOW MANY WHITE PEOPLE WERE IN THAT AUDIENCE?! It was a surplus of White people if I ever saw it.

e.) I am scared. She scares me. The RNC scares me. McCain scares me. BUUUUT, I am exponentially motivated to help put Obama/Biden in the White House.

She compared women to Pit Bulls. Just with Lipstick. How insulting was that?

She compared women to Pit Bulls. Just with Lipstick. How insulting was that? Might has well just called us "Bitches". She is there as a distractor, Her mission is to cause divisiveness amoung women, and distract us from looking at the issues and lack of substance.

She compared women to Pit Bulls. Just with Lipstick. How insulting was that? Might has well just called us "Bitches". She is there as a distracter, Her mission is to cause divisiveness among women, and distract us from looking at the issues and lack of substance.

Is it just me, or did she shy away from most issues that are important to women?

I certainly admire the fierceness she showed, but we all know too well that she wouldn't use that to fight for women's rights, and in fact, could use that counter it. While I can respect her strength (while totally disagreeing with her politics), she doesn't represent my values, and neither does McCain. I'm voting Obama because he is the only change I can believe in.

I thought she was a good speaker. If she stays in the race I will defend her against any sexist remarks. That said, I can not and will not vote for Mccain under any circumstances. I am a former Hillary supporter and am following Hillary's lead in supporting Obama.

I taped it. But I don't know if it will be any easier to swallow later. Thanks to all of you for preparing me.

I am glad that she talked a little about John McCain's military service, since that topic has been really underplayed at the convention so far. And I wish people would talk more about that whole "maverick" thing too, I'd like to know more about that.

Romney's speech made me ill, Huckabee's made me roll my eyes, Giuliani's was infuriating, and Palin was downright offensive.

After the integrity Obama has shown when asked about Palin, she comes out personally attacking him, mocking his public service, and downright lying about his record. What a bitter, mean-spirited, deceitful, corrupt woman. I was shaking throughout her speech.
And what makes it worse is the fact that she's being used as a Trojan Horse. Christian Taliban policies and dirty politics wrapped in a pretty package.
Of course the Republicans will use sexism as a hammer with which to beat everyone who challenges her stances or record of service. The same people who laughed at Hillary nutcrackers, who made fun of her pantsuits and criticized her mothering abilities, will insist that they are the true feminists because they support Sarah Palin - a woman with a white supremacist, patriarchal agenda. My head is spinning and to be honest I'm pretty scared.

Did anyone catch her Daughter (middle one) rolling her eyes when Rudy was saying that her being VP wouldn't take time away from family. The body language of the family, gave her away. Notice the absence of her mother in law also. I can't wait tell the debates. Biden is more of a feminist than she could ever hope to be. Her whoring out of her children is the direct opposite of the "family values" she so adamantly defends.. and how the heck did the baby sleep through all that noise?

I am shocked by most of the comments on this thread. Perhaps I myself am already biased the other way, but it is surprising to me how differently a person can be perceived depending on whether or not somebody agrees with her from the outset.

I found Sarah Palin to be well-spoken and humble and was impressed by how so much of what she spoke about revealed a true sympathy with and commitment to working class people. She constantly deflected attention away from herself; most of the speech was about her family, about citizens, or about John McCain. Barely any of it was about her.

Instead of having connections with Washington insiders or corporations, Palin focused on her husband, a blue-collar worker, her sister, a small business owner, and the average American small-town citizen. As somebody who was done a lot of community service work in impoverished American small-towns (including West VA, which she explicitly mentioned in terms of increasing jobs), I was impressed by her focus. I simply do not see how anyone could read her respect for the working class as "only addressing the richest people in the country."

Furthermore, I was actually surprised by how NOT nasty her comments about Obama were. Compared to most politicians, she was downright kindhearted in speaking about him! I'm not sure you all heard the same speech I did...

Finally, I don't think she is using her children as a political ploy. If I were running for office, I would be thrilled to have my family in the audience to support me. I also would want to make sure I got to spend as much time as possible in the presence of my small children, even if it meant letting them stay up a little late and go to speeches. I think it is sick how so many feminists pretend to support strong women, but then turn around and support them only when they make a certain choice about their career and family (ie don't have many children and wait till they grow up to start your career in earnest). I thought feminism was about choice and freedom, but apparently that only applies to one kind of woman.

I missed Palin's speech tonight, but I noticed the baby passing during her introduction speech last week...specifically that the one person who never touched the child was the FATHER. All I could thing was...clearly this is orchestrated. We clearly don't want to portray Mr. Palin as completely emmasculated (his wife is already running for one of the highest offices in the nation), so let's make it clear that he's not like a wimpy guy that like takes care of his babies or anything....that's a woman's job.

Her husband held the baby for about half of this speech and has agreed to stay home from work if she wins.

Ditto on the staged baby-passing routine. I spent half my time wondering who would hold him next...

And I'm still awaiting the impending shotgun wedding. God-forbid a baby is born to an unwed teenage mother of the Republican VP candidate!

Well she can read a speech well off of a teleprompter but that is no indicator about how she will do in live debate. I sincerely hope that Biden hands her woman hating ass walking papers. I love the way that she announced the cuts that she made without mentioning that she cut services to women. Of course she supports young pregnant teens that are named Bristol or happen to be fruit of her womb.
It was a snarky speech filled with lies. I find it interesting that the Republicans are screaming about sexism aimed at Palin while their supporters are wearing buttons labeled the sexist VP. SO it is only sexism when the democrats or liberals do it right? Oh how I love the party of womens liberation if only all political parties could be as supportive of women as the republican party.

@wickedwench - OMG, I was thinking the exact same thing about her voice when I heard her the other day. "Oh, Ed! You sounded just like Dirty Harry!"

I see, so when Republicans "use women suffering under the Taliban as an excuse" that is wrong, but sitting back and doing nothing about the plight of those women is somehow acceptable?

theogirl,

It isn't about what is or is not between her legs, it is what is between her ears, Just because she is female, doesn't mean she has womens interests at heart. I don't have a problem with having her kids there to watch her, but using them as props and pawn, while asking us to leave them out of the discussion is hypocritical. Asking us to overlook basic constitutional rights of due process and Miranda rights because someone is accused of Terrorist activities is an insult to my intelligence and the principles of equal rights and human rights to all. Comparing women to Dogs, is dehumanizing, degrading, and shows a lack of sophistication, and understanding of the basic inequalities facing women today.

This infuriates me:

"I guess being a small-town mayor is like being a community organizer, except you have actual responsibilities."

Being a mayor of a small town means that you rubber stamp decisions by your town council and sit back while the state and county authorities take care of all the facilities in your jurisdiction. Unless there's a major crisis that for some reason requires mayoral intervention, mayors can run small towns on cruise control 9-to-5; the town will survive, especially in Palin's case with the infusion of oil wealth in the Wasilla, AK area.

Community organizing requires 24/7/365 commitment to a far greater range of issues, from fiscal, to ideological, to emotional, to imagined--because the entire organization depends on collective action and perceived success. If the organizer fails, the organization fails--there is no coercive element to appeal to. If the organizer does his/her best job, the organization may STILL fail, because there's nothing keeping the people together but their own fragile preferences, morality, and diffuse reciprocity. Additionally, community organizations fill in when the municipality has failed, wanted, or disappeared--when the organizer fails, the community itself really can die, or suffer terribly.

I guess being a community organizer is a lot like being a small-town mayor, except you have actual responsibilities.

As an Obama supporter and a Clinton admirer, it makes me so happy to hear that Clinton supporters are backing Obama. I keep telling myself that any person who followed Hillary Clinton could not vote for McCain because their politics are completely different. So I'm ecstatic to see that those who are undecided are as put off by the Republicans as I am.

One thing that is particularly disheartening is how the RNC is not even trying to cross party lines and extend a sort of olive branch to anyone other than Republicans. At the DNC, you heard many of the speakers mention trying to reach out to Independents and Republicans. At the RNC, Mitt Romney led a chant that slammed Liberals.

It is also semi-hilarious to me that the RNC is using Obama's slogans (A Change We Can Believe In) and trying to make them sound ridiculous. Change and Progress are two things that I am looking for for this country and the Republicans won't be the ones delivering it.

Someone should remind her that her running mate is still officially part of what she termed the "do nothing Senate," despite the fact that he shows up to vote less than half the time.

I found her condescending and disrespectful. I also felt like she was trying to be cute with her smart ass remarks.

I know the media's focusing on the women who say they like her because they can relate to her. Why isn't anyone pointing out that Bush was a governor (executive experience) and the guy people wanted to have a beer with...look how that turned out!

I hate to tell her this, but that hockey mom/pit bull joke was originally used as a slap against Eric Lindros' mother Bonnie, who was crucified in the Canadian press for being a bossy, overbearing bitch. Is she really dumb enough to claim it as a term of *pride*?

Theogirl, one thought I had whilst listening to Palin was, "This woman is not very Christ-like."

The way she (and others) mocked Obama's communiity organizing experience was shameful. She LIED. The other speakers LIED. All they have now is "biography and culture wars" as someone on Pandagon put it, so they just throw low blows and spread misinformation about their opponents and about themselves.
Palin was FOR the Bridge to Nowhere, she secured earmarks for herself (before she was against them!), she called the Iraq War a mission from god, she even tried to ban books in her city's library as mayor! The list goes on and on. The woman is frightening, and you can tell that her family has been completely ambushed by her acceptance of this role.

theogirl, you say that you were impressed by Palin "as somebody who was done a lot of community service work in impoverished American small-towns". How did you feel about Palin's (and Giuliani's) negative and dismissive comments about community organizers?

Profstout,

What you mean is that she doesn't have liberal womens' interests at heart.

Where is this definition of what it is to be a woman that everyone here seems to refer to? As far as I know, I and all of the other conservative ladies I know ARE women and proud to be women. Feminism is supposed to be about defying stereotypes and rejecting imposed standards - so why this imposed standard about what makes somebody a woman or not? Why this defined and rigid set of what "womens' interests" are? The feminist establishment seems to dictate how a woman has to behave just as much as patriarchal society or the Church ever has; the standards are just different.

Personally, I think "womens' interests" should refer to whatever goals a large number of women would like to see accomplished. Sarah Palin shares the same goals with a whole lot of women in this country.

My favorite part was when the younger daughter was holding the baby, and just as the camera cut to her she licked the palm of her hand and combed the baby's hair down with it. Classic.

To add another comment, I just want to echo what a lot of the posters and bloggers have been saying here the last couple of days.

I'm glad Bristol Palin had a choice. Thank God, America and NARAL (among others) that she had that choice, regardless of what her Mother and her Mother's party have to say about anyone else's choices. I consider it a privilege to fight for the right of Bristol Palin--and families everywhere--to have that choice.

EvilSlutClique,

I did not watch Giuliani's speech; I don't like him very much.

I am not particularly offended by what Palin said, because she has a very good point. Community organizers can play a vital role, and can do a lot of good, but they do not have the same responsibilities as do governing authorities. Sarah Palin is the only candidate in this race who has actually had governing experience, and the responsibilities that come with that are completely different from those that come from being a community organizer. I think the point is that community organizing, however beneficial, does not prepare one to be President of Vice President of the United States, whereas governing does. As much as I've helped out communities, I certainly wouldn't feel qualified to run for political office...

Palin reminds me of the mom from Bobby's World.

She is playing the overbearing, gossipy, judgemental PTA mom with this schtick (or maybe it's real). Either way, it's totally off-putting and the idea that such a person could soon be VP is keeping me up tonight.

I can say one thing, Sarah Palin makes a great cheerleader. But that's all she is, a cheerleader and a trophy VP. Republicans makes me fuckin depressed and I don't know what I'll do if they win.

The best thing I've seen was when this guy on MSNBC compared her to Tracy Flick from "Election".

So now that Palin is the VP pick, "governing experience" is suddenly THE requirement one must have to be POTUS. Curious.

Can I just say that I can't wait for Rachel Maddow's show to start so I can hear what she has to say about Palin?

"Personally, I think 'womens' interests' should refer to whatever goals a large number of women would like to see accomplished. Sarah Palin shares the same goals with a whole lot of women in this country."

theogirl, I sincerely hope that Palin doesn't represent the same goals as a whole lot of women in this country. Lets just look at one issueL while pro-lifers cling to her and McCain, they seem to forget that pro-choice is far more than just abortion rights. It's about comprehensive sex education, access to affordable birth control and emergency contraception, not to mention empowering women to have agency over their own bodies. I think an important "women's issue" is the ability to plan when they want to be mothers. With the majority of women on some form of birth control, why wouldn't you think a majority support that right? If you vote for McCain/Palin, you might be in for a rude awakening.

Theogirl:

I would be very afraid if running the town of Wassila, AK made you feel more prepared to be one heartbeat away from the presidency. There are governing authorities, and there are governing authorities. Being governor is a better example, a true administrative body (although one of the weakest governorships in the US). But not being a small town mayor.

You may not feel ready to be VP, but the fact is you had more responsibility than Gov. Palin did when she was Mayor. I know, I've worked for Mayors of a small town in upstate NY. This is what I'm basing my point on.

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I do agree that all women have the right to stand up for their issues...

their is a problem when anti-woman issues are being called "liberating" for women. Dont say your breaking the glass ceiling when your really sealing it and then calling it a victory for all women. Yup, THEOGIRL you are right. All women have the right to stand for their issues and thats what feminists fight for. But it is a slap in the face for her to use what I guess you would call liberal feminists worked for to support an anti-women president. Sorry.

To me its how I think about my views. I am closed minded to close minded views. I believe that everyone has the right to live a certain way but they shouldnt put on me. Someone like Palin is working to restrict my rights and call it womens liberation (breaking the glass ceiling?)! Thats a big problem.

theogirl,

If as you say "Feminism is supposed to be about defying stereotypes and rejecting imposed standards" then why was it necessary to compare women to dogs?
You originally stated "I think it is sick how so many feminists pretend to support strong women, but then turn around and support them only when they make a certain choice about their career and family"
Your assuming that I don't support her because of her choices to have a family and a career, I don't support her because with her speech tonight, she has clearly demonstrated that she is not qualified to be VP. A person in that position need to think before speaking, about the ramification of what they are saying, along with the intelligence of statements. Based solely on that speech I have no problems in rejecting her. If I take her positions on issues that matter to me personally into consideration it is even easier. She is for abstinence only sex-education, but clearly that didn't work for her daughter, She has cut funds to teenage daughters, She is not pro environment, if she wants to drill, She has raised more taxes that she has cut, (funny how that got left out of the speech).. More than any other thing, what pains me greatly, is that here she is, only the second woman to get a VP nod, and she had the world as her stage, and she took that moment to be insulting to women, and not mention, any of the myriad of issues that she could have.

Did anyone else notice that McCain said to her husband "Great job" after her speech?

Theogirl, McCain doesn't have any governing experience either by these new Republican standards.

Well I am a mom and I am really pissed. I hate her. She doesn't seem to care about her own children or anyone. Her son is going off to war in Iraq and she does not shed a tear for him. She does not mention her daughter who is carrying her first grandchild. She mentions her disabled child, but once again does not shed a tear about his disability. She handed him off to other members of her family. Why couldn't see stand there and make her speech with her son in a baby carrier or sling? I put up tents, I volunteered, I walked miles with my child attached to me for the first year of her life. Why was her child drinking milk from a bottle? He already is disabled, why wouldn't she do the best thing she could for him and breastfeed him?

I'm not being sexist, I was equally pissed that John Edwards did not end his campaign when his wife found out she had breast cancer. Now we find out he was cheating on her too! I am even concerned that Obama is putting his life at risk when he has young daughters to raise. Losing my own father at a young age I know how these girls could feel to lose their dad.

Maybe personal stuff and politics shouldn't mix, but I can't help but dislike someone who is a mom and doesn't even bother to mention in her speech all of the issues modern women who are mothers are facing these days. What about health care, equal pay, longer maternity leave and the right to breastfeed in public? These are not democratic or republican issues, but issues that all mothers face. Instead she just attacked Obama and Biden. Not on of all things their experance when she has none!

I also wonder if she was working so hard when did she find time to be a member of the PTA? I work 40 hours a week at a pointless job and I cannot find time to do my laundry with one kid.

This is rich. We who oppose Palin could write 900 comments about Palin's scary views, hypocritical rhetoric, and corrupt actions as mayor/Gov(and I've seen it done over on Jezebel and other blogs), and her supporters will STILL insist that we dislike her because we disagree with her family choices.
:Throws hands up in air: I'm going to bed.

Correction to previous post.. (past my bed time)

Should read.
If, as you say "Feminism is supposed to be about defying stereotypes and rejecting imposed standards" then why was it necessary to compare women to dogs?

You originally stated "I think it is sick how so many feminists pretend to support strong women, but then turn around and support them only when they make a certain choice about their career and family"

Your assuming that I don't support her because of her choices to have a family and a career,(that would be a false assumption) I don't support her because with her speech tonight, she has clearly demonstrated that she is not qualified to be VP. A person in that position needs to think before speaking, specifically about the ramification of what they are saying, along with the intelligence of statements. Based solely on that speech I have no problems in rejecting her.

If I also take her positions on issues that matter to me personally into consideration it is even easier to reject her. She is for abstinence only sex-education, but clearly that didn't work for her daughter, She has cut funds to teenage mothers, and unwed mothers, She is not pro environment, if she wants to drill. She has raised more taxes that she has cut, (funny how that got left out of the speech)..

However, more than any other thing, what pains me greatly, is that here she is, only the second woman to get a VP nod, and she had the world as her stage, and she took that moment to be insulting to women, and not mention, any of the myriad of issues that she could have.

SarahMC,

Rich with Irony.... considering how Hillary was treated ^5

Theogirl,

When I say it seems to me that Palin is talking only to the richest people, I am picking up on some subtleties.

The GOP's economic policies tend to rely on heaping benefits on corporations and tax cuts on the rich and hoping it will "trickle down". In reality, that hasn't happened. She says she doesn't want to "redistribute America's wealth, but grow it". that means it will get bigger, but stay in the same hands. The rich will get richer.

She also talks about the Dems wanting to "increase taxes" which in actuality would increase for the richest of the rich, and would be cut for the middle class. so in that instance she must be speaking to those very rich that would face tax increases according to Obama's plan.

Not to mention the privilege that is required for someone to even begin to live out the "family values" that she claims to promote.

GOP politicians always mention small town values and family values and whatnot, because it's in their interest to get people to vote against their own interests. Their policies seem, to me, to be catering to the richest 1% of the population, but they need to convince people to vote for them so they pander to the family values crowd and exploit people for values and religion that they hold in earnest.

Yes, Palin is a woman. Yes, I support the idea of women in power. but part of being a feminist is that I don't have some rose-colored glasses on when i see a woman in power. equality means women should have the same access to power that men have. and that they are equally as susceptible to critique and scrutiny. its not all about anatomy. Its about policy.

-k

Theogirl,

When I say it seems to me that Palin is talking only to the richest people, I am picking up on some subtleties.

The GOP's economic policies tend to rely on heaping benefits on corporations and tax cuts on the rich and hoping it will "trickle down". In reality, that hasn't happened. She says she doesn't want to "redistribute America's wealth, but grow it". that means it will get bigger, but stay in the same hands. The rich will get richer.

She also talks about the Dems wanting to "increase taxes" which in actuality would increase for the richest of the rich, and would be cut for the middle class. so in that instance she must be speaking to those very rich that would face tax increases according to Obama's plan.

Not to mention the privilege that is required for someone to even begin to live out the "family values" that she claims to promote.

GOP politicians always mention small town values and family values and whatnot, because it's in their interest to get people to vote against their own interests. Their policies seem, to me, to be catering to the richest 1% of the population, but they need to convince people to vote for them so they pander to the family values crowd and exploit people for values and religion that they hold in earnest.

Yes, Palin is a woman. Yes, I support the idea of women in power. but part of being a feminist is that I don't have some rose-colored glasses on when i see a woman in power. equality means women should have the same access to power that men have. and that they are equally as susceptible to critique and scrutiny. its not all about anatomy. Its about policy.

-k

"Wow, first thing I notice is how bitter the GOP seems to be. I mean, Obama went after McCain, but I feel it wasn't nearly as snarky or snide or as bush league (anyone know where that term comes from, btw? is it a vagina reference???) as the GOP speakers are. The Dems had such a positive message, this is a very stark contrast. Not that I should be surprised..."

I noticed that too.

since the content and obvious baby passing choreography have already been so well addressed already, i'll just add that boy does she have that george w. bush signature smirk mastered.

Kate, Maddow's show should be great, but she was oddly vapid in her first reaction to the Palin news, I thought. Hope it was just the "Sarah who?" effect that got everyone last week.

Theogirl, think about Rudy and Palin's silly comparison for a second. They're mocking his work as a community organizer because they can't address his ACTUAL experience in the IL state senate for 8 years, representing a constituency of 220,000 people, or as a U.S. senator serving 13,000,000 constituents. She was mayor of town of 5000 people until 20 months ago.

If you aren't sneezing milk out of your nose when the Reeps try and paint her "experience" as on par with Obama, then you aren't paying attention.

Oh, and BlackFeminist, I agree with your first post completely. I felt that way too. I just knew all those people would crush working class little me (and you) under their boot if they could, without a second thought.

I think thegirl is a McCain plant. They've been trolling progressive sites trying to pose as women who support Palin. Or, alternately, "angry Hillary supporters" who are voting for McCain. McCain's campaign has been paying people to do this; it's supposed to make him seem more popular than he really is.

I've only read about half the comments so far, but before I continue, I HAVE to say this:

Being a governor for 20 months does NOT mean you are qualified to be President. You would need at least one full term as a governor to use that title as an actual qualification.
And, no offense to Alaskans (seriously, I mean that, this is no way intended to insult Alaska, which I am sure is an absolutely wonderful and beautiful state), but being the governor of Alaska especially does not qualify you, simply because of the way Alaskan government works. Based on fiscal policies alone, Palin's experience as governor of Alaska does not qualify her to be part of the executive branch, since Alaska's fiscal and monetary system is so different from that of Washington's and pretty much every other state in this country.

Also, Giuliani totally pissed me off. Since when were Al Qaeda and Bin Laden affiliated with Iraq? Oh, that's right, NEVER.
Do you think that the RNC could exploit the troops who are currently overseas or those who have died in this current war any more than they already have? It's totally sickening.

I agree with ispacescientist. Theogirl most certaintly sounds like a plant. She doesn't seem to talk (write) like a young person. NO ONE on this site supports crazy, creepy palin who talks weird and clearly belies her inexperience, childishness and idiotic views. Shes a token. I wouldnt be surprised if she had bolts on the back of her head that if you unscrewed them would find nothing but a wires and pulleys robot. Get it? I DONT care that she has a vagina. I CARE that her views are irrational.

Sarah Palin is just not who I want anywhere near the office...I think Ann made a great point when Sarah Palin's VP bid was announced...I think it's great that women have come this far and to have a woman running as VP, but she in no way represents or even protects my rights as a woman so why in the hell should I vote for her?

Just because we have the same anatomy? hell no...and to be honest I think the RNC's obvious move to capture the women vote is insulting...I wasn't a Clinton admirer/supporter because she had a vagina...I was because of her polititcs and her qualifications...I'm funny like that I actually make sure that the candidates I like and vote for actually seem to agree with me in the issues...and is someone that I believe can be an effectual leader...

Sarah Palin is against comprehensive sex education, right to choice, equal pay, etc...why would I vote for someone with such obvious and vocal disagreements for some if not all matters that are important to me?...just because we are of the same sex is not enough for me...

How dumb do you have to be to wear "hottest VP" tags and shout "drill, baby, drill!" W-h-a-t friggin -i-d-i-o-t-s!! No way am I voting for the New Fascists!

Megs,
What? Dont you want to vote The Genitalia vote? Thats what swayed me! I like the fact that we both have vaginas! Its way cool!

"Personally, I think "womens' interests" should refer to whatever goals a large number of women would like to see accomplished."

Well now that'd just be stupid. Women in the early 1900s didnt want the vote either. Does that mean they had womens interests in mind? Of course not. It just simply shows that they were far to disabled from the environment they lived in to respect themselves and expect to be represented in government. Its always been a small group of people that wins the rights for everyone, not the mass ignorant.

And please....dont use the whole faux pas "feminist establishment dictator" song and dance. It is soooo old. Your argument that feminism is the same as patriarchy is idiotic. Anyways why would you choose to identify with the patriarchy rather than feminists even if you did go by your own definition? Essentially youre saying that feminism is simply women claiming to be superior to men which you say is the exact same thing as misogyny. Very, very stupid. How about you go on a Stupid people blog and talk amongst your own?

WHy oh WHY is a conservative right-dinger on this site? Oh well, I can make do. Asx for me, a cat needs to scratch its claws on something to sharpen them.

The nastiness hurled at Michelle Obama was disgusting, but I'm sure the press will ignore it as it has done for this entire election cycle. On women's issues: Gov. Palin must never make choices for me! On Patriotism: I'm a proud, black American and I'd like to remind Gov. Palin that black Americans loved America when American didn't love them. I'm so sick of the republican agenda of painting Barack and Michelle as "others" who are un-American. Can we get back to the issues?

I'm trusting you all saw Peggy Noonan's live mic comments from earlier, calling Palin's appointment "bullshit" and wondering why Kay Bailey Hutchinson or someone actually qualified wasn't nominated.

( http://gawker.com/5045088/peggy-noonan-unplugged-yeah-that-sarah-palin-pick-was-bullshit?autoplay=true )

Say what you want about Peggy Noonan, but she's a woman in politics whose intelligence I can respect, even when I disagree. Here, I agree, so it's easy, and it's heartening to see realist non-gimmicky Christian Republicans airing the same concerns as Feministing.

"Personally, I think "womens' interests" should refer to whatever goals a large number of women would like to see accomplished."

Well now that'd just be stupid. Women in the early 1900s didnt want the vote either. Does that mean they had womens interests in mind? Of course not. It just simply shows that they were far to disabled from the environment they lived in to respect themselves and expect to be represented in government. Its always been a small group of people that wins the rights for everyone, not the mass ignorant.

And please....dont use the whole faux pas "feminist establishment dictator" song and dance. It is soooo old. Your argument that feminism is the same as patriarchy is idiotic. Anyways why would you choose to identify with the patriarchy rather than feminists even if you did go by your own definition? Essentially youre saying that feminism is simply women claiming to be superior to men which you say is the exact same thing as misogyny. Very, very stupid. How about you go on a Stupid people blog and talk amongst your own?

WHy oh WHY is a conservative right-dinger on this site? Oh well, I can make do. As for me, a cat needs to scratch its claws on something to sharpen them.

I want to ask... to be fair

When Obama's kids were on TV after Michelle's speech, was he parading them around too?

I honestly do think it is strange how much she talks about her children, and about being a mother. She always does, but she doesn't want to be judged as a mother. I am confused.. seeing her children doesn't bother me..

And speaking of McCain plants... I think it is funny that his campaign picks and chooses what they respond to on the blogs. They picked the story about Palin's son really being her grandson, and judging her parenting ability because Bristol is pregnant. BUT they won't address they fact that pissed off Hillary supports and so many women.

They cry sexism, but they wear "Hottest VP" buttons! They are hypocrites.

I also saw John McCain on the news talking about his pick. The question was asked to him: Did you pick Sarah Palin, because she is a woman and you want to carry Hillary voters?

He said, "No, I picked her for America." Does he think we are total fucking morons? Excuse the language, but he was using Hillary in his anti-Obama ads. We all know he was trying to get the Hillary vote.. who does he think he is fooling??

The thought of this deranged woman being the #2 in the United States makes me physically ill. Her speech was fluffy at best and juvenile at worst. Relying on smart-ass comments and cheap shots at Obama to illicit a giggle and knowing nod from the RNC's frigid, white, wealthy power base made me feel like I was in the 8th grade again, running for president of National Honor Society.

Her children looked moderately terrified and genuinely uncomfortable when their mom pimped them out in front of a prime time audience, case in point:

1) Son Track, looked as if he may vomit and kept side-whispering to someone acting like he wanted to be anywhere but where he was at the moment.

2) Daughter Bristol and her baby-daddy clinging awkwardly to each other like an 80 year old couple in a church service. Honestly, what 17 year old kids hold hands like that? I wonder how many times they practiced? And how long after November 4th before the wedding is called off?

3) Little daughter Willow licking her hand to flatten Trig's hair: priceless. Judging by the wetness of his hair, it seemed as if the coached Willow had been giving the cameras every opportunity to capture this "spontaneous" moment.

Thoughts I Take Away:

- I have never seen a less enthused and more coached audience. There were definite hilarious moments when Palin said something heroic, paused for an applause, and nothing happened. Love it.

- Has anyone seen the movie "Drop Dead Gorgeous"?
If so, you will understand me when I say that Palin is totally the St. Paul Pork Products Lady--- "I love it so much, I WORK HERE NOW!"

- Whoever said Palin bears much resemblance to Tracy Flick in "Election" was totally right on. Apparently the people in the audience that made signs reading, "Palin Power" were also fans of that film ---
"Paul. Power. Paul Power. Paul for President..."

Has anyone seen the movie "Drop Dead Gorgeous"?
If so, you will understand me when I say that Palin is totally the St. Paul Pork Products Lady--- "I love it so much, I WORK HERE NOW!"

Oh my gosh, you're so right!
Palin really did sound like she had a suppressed Minnesotan (spelling?) accent.
And now I can't stop laughing because I'm imagining Palin, holding sausages and wearing slaughter-house gear, saying, "I love it so much, I WORK HERE NOW!"

First off can we all please stop with the, “I can’t stand her voice”? I may actually turn to violence by the end of this election. I was a Hillary supporter. I have voted in the past and have had candidates not win the nomination and still I voted for the candidate that did. So can we all please stop with the Hillary voters are gonna vote their vagina? I hated it the first time around.

Look there are ALL kinds of people in this country. This speech is going to inspire those that feel the way Palin does. She said all the things that the Republican Party has been schilling for like the past 28 years now. She did it very competently. Too bad for those in the media that tried to use her beauty pageant stuff against her, maybe now they will actually have to have a real debate here. Bush Jr., Clinton, Reagan, and I believe Carter were all governors, so it’s neither good nor bad with me. I believe the only pre-requisite for VP or President is to be a native born citizen of the United States and over 35 years of age, so she’s qualified. Also, the fact that she is not part of the current political machine is going to endear her to some folks. The way that persona has been successful for Obama.

Now, her politics are just not shared by me. She did her job and rallied the young neo-con base; we just need to make sure that those who do not share those views actually vote this time. I do not believe the way to win this election is to appeal to the right, they are already voting conservative. Obama and Biden need to appeal to everyone else. I really thought that Obama’s speech was amazing. He said something to the effect of having a debate without attacking a person’s character. However, in the same week many who support him attacked Palin’s family, for being a beauty queen, for being the governor of Alaska, now here with her annoying voice, etc... I think we have the opportunity here to be better than the last eight years, let’s not squander it.

Okay..she delivered a good speech. lets see how she does with the interviews and debates. on the whole women's issues. she doesn't represent liberal women at all, and she's not going to pretend to. so the whole pro-choice debate isn't going to get it. we have to point out that if you want young women to do the right thing and have their babies you have to support programs that help them, not cut their funding like she did and not support these social service cuts that the republicans always do, lets not forget headstart and SChip.--Bristol's pregnant and they are going to spin that. but what I want to see is them spin that picture of Bristol partying mid-day with alcohol and guns,please governor Palin explain who was suppose be watching little Bristol when her and Levi posed with three guns. don't we have an emerging problem with middle class kids with excess to legally purchased guns going crazy in this country and shooting up malls and schools. this is a prime example of irresponsible parents leaving their weapons around for their kids to mishandle.
I say if they keep proclaiming that she's a mother of five as a qualification for VP then we can judge how good of a job she is doing, as a mother. for example, they keep saying she is the governor of Alaska, so we can examine her record on that. And maybe Bristol needed to be supervised a lot more.

Off the cultural stuff--sarah the reformer, offers way more then an alternative to Hillary, PUMA you overstated your importance. She's offering the whole state of Alaska for drilling, 'Drill baby Drill'. They made it seem like if we just vote for sarah we are guaranteeing that Alaska will be opened up. Can she promise that. If so, that corrupt senator she supposedly took down was very short sighted. he sold out to the oil companies and all he got was his house repaired, she's getting the white house, and a nice nanny for Bristol. And won't she be dealing with the same american oil companies that have always been in Alaska, putting even more money in their pockets. I smell a rat. Obama don't let us down, attack!

I'm live in Alaska and am glad to find solidarity online - this state is backwards, and though there are a few intelligent feminists up here, there are not enough as is apparent with this ridiculous V.P. nomination.

Quick comments from this feed:
Yes, the Covenant House line item veto is true. I was worked at CHA when it all went down. However, the money was not to directly benefit the Passage House, but to move the crisis shelter out of the middle of downtown. It is currently between the Egan center and Dena'ina Convention Center and is definitely not a safe, low-profile site. What I can say is that many young, pregnant girls do live in the crisis center (which is mostly full) as they wait for a place to open at Passage House (which is always 100% full). All funds were removed the first veto time-around and yet a bird-watching kiosk was funded....this second time the cash was reduced by 20%, but at least it made it in.

The littlest girl is not Willow, but Piper (after the plane...better than being named Cessna)who was licking Trig's hair. And my bet is that Willow the middle-child will someday write a memoir of how her parents abandoned and used her and siblings for political gain.

I'm fully embarrassed that apparently women in Alaska are back-country enough to a)possibly not finish high school b)not learn about birth control c)feel the need to marry baby-daddy at 17. And this all under a governor who is anti-choice with no exception and running a state which has one of the highest rape per capital rates in the U.S. It can be frightful and downright deadly in a bush village in the winter.

Quite often we elitists from Anchorage will discount someone as being from "the valley", meaning Wasilla, and everyone immediately knows this to be derogatory. I wish I could compare Wasilla to other small towns in all 50 states. Maybe...Wasilla is like Sequim, Washington or LaPine, Oregon or Van, Texas or I don't know, help me out! It really is a crummy little town that we all avoid except to stop for ice cream at Miller's.

FINALLY, No really, it is different up here, and its odd, and I love Alaska for the beauty of landscape, but seriously, don't take us that seriously. And honestly, this whole V.P. thing is a joke and smells of oil dealings. I love my AK as it is....I don't want to see it pillaged. We all moved here for a reason, to get away from the masses! It is frightening to watch as the next black gold rush approaches.

Thoughts and Questions welcomed!

I gotta add more:

What I thought of her speech? - Petty, sarcastic, and vague.

Especially during Ruddy's speech I kept thinking that I was watching an American Football Pep Rally. I half expected to see Bristol in her cheer leading outfit. It was all about bashing the opponent as a way of reflecting on one's god-like status...and yet without giving reason of why "our" team is so great.

But here's the best thing about it! The local news channel KTUU came on air and immediately went to a reporter who was at the Peanut Farm...a local sports bar AND THEN out to Wasilla at the Tailgater's Sports Bar. So whereas locals met at the Performing Art's Center to watch Obama's speech (granted, it was on a football field), the Right all went to the bar (appropriate for AK) so I guess it really was akin to a high school pep rally!

The overwhelming sense I got from both Palin and Giuliani's speeches was that the Republicans are scared and defensive.

Oh, and petty.

Oh, and liars.

Oh, and racists.

Oh, and they definitely have underestimated my intelligence. Actually, I think they've underestimated the intelligence of the country as a whole.

I love America.

I don't care for Republicans.

I hope people don't vote for them, and that they don't have any more opportunities to run this country that I love into the ground.

@ LoveFromAlaska:
I only have a shallow understanding of the tax system in Alaska. Could you perhaps explain a bit about the whole no-sales-tax, oil-tax-and-payment-to-residents thing?

And thank you for the perspective on Wasilla. According to Karl Rove (whom I'm sure we all love ever so much), it's the second largest city in Alaska. That didn't sound right to me (I mean c'mon, a town of 9,000 people? Even in Alaska, I'm sure there are at least a few more-populated cities.), but I'm a bit too tired to research right now.

Sarah Palin is a hack, just like the rest of the Republican politicians out there. Her speech 'electrified' because it was full of the same spite, hate and venom that fulls the Conservative Base. Ever been on any conservative blogs? Just read the comment sections. Better yet, just find a bunch of blogs, read the comment sections only, and guess which are conservative and which are liberal. HINT: the comments at the conservative blogs are poorly written and mostly invectives.

Anyway, shame on her. After Obama was decent enough to defend her and her family, she used her speech to rail against him. It was full of lies, arrogance, condescension and downright hate. He ought to sue her for slander for some of those comments.

I'm sorry, but I think any female (or any other minority) that identifies themselves with today's Republican Party is a hypocrite and should be barred from public office. If the Sarah Palin's of the nation got their way they would not even be allowed to run for office, much less hold it. They should be locked inside their homes and forced to cook and clean all day, and turned into baby mills. Let them get the first taste of how shitty their ideal world would be for themselves and their daughters.

@ Lauren

I'm actually from Wasilla - it's not the biggest city in Alaska, but it's the biggest in the Matanuska-Susitna Valley. Juneau and Fairbanks are both larger with about 30000 people each, but they are isolated (Fairbanks is in the interior and friggin' cold, and roads do not go to Juneau).

Alaska has a regressive tax system - no income tax, no state sales tax, but HEAVY property taxes. The citizens pay beaucoup bucks, while the visitors who work on the slope and don't live here pay nothing. Palin introduced heavy sales taxes in Wasilla, even on food. The Permanent Fund Dividend (PFD) is a distribution of a percent of oil investment profits to the citizens, introduced by governor Jay Hammond. The principle is that Alaska reserves are common property, and so the profits should be distributed to the citizenry. It's a very small amount, but considering Alaska has large working/poverty class populations, it can make a big difference. Especially to those living in the bush.

LoveFromAlaska is totally right about how "the Valley" is viewed. Over the past few years, the Valley has been overtaken with fundamentalists and the religious right, which is largely how Sarah Palin was able to take the mayoral seat - by campaigning on hot-button religious issues like abortion, that are irrelevant to running a small town.

She kicked off her mayorship with mass firings of experienced city employees that she disagreed with politically. She attempted to fire a beloved librarian, after the librarian said she would call the ACLU if Palin banned any books - the city protested, and Palin withdrew the termination. After these political mistakes, it was decided that she needed assistance - a town manager was hired, and he did most of the work running the town while Palin became a figurehead. This is how Wasilla has been run ever since.

This letter from Anne Kilkenny is actually completely accurate, at least on the items I know about. I know some questions of it's validity have been raised, but as a Wasilla resident I can attest to about 90% of it - http://www.andrys.com/palin-kilkenny.html

I didn't see the entire speech since I'm in the UK and the time difference made it difficult (I'm staying in a hotel room with other people who wanted to sleep) but the clips I've seen this morning and the comments I've read make it pretty clear. I can honestly say that I wish I were an American citizen for the first time in my life just so that I could vote for Obama/Biden. As a Canadian citizen, I think Pierre Trudeau said it best: "Living next to [the USA] is in some ways like sleeping with an elephant. No matter how friendly and even-tempered is the beast, if I can call it that, one is affected by every twitch and grunt." We all have a stake in this election, American or not, and I know I'm speaking largely to the converted here, but I sincerely hope that every one of you will go out and exercise your franchise in November.

"I thought feminism was about choice and freedom"

I'm sure that is one value and politic of feminism. If so, then I don't see how Palin is advancing that value and politic:

Will she be supporting a President and Administration and introducing and support public policies and programs that create conditions of choice and freedom for 300 million Americans, such as the choice to abort or not abort for 151 million American women, including advocating for birth-control education and free and low-cost access? I doubt it.

Will she be supporting a Presient and Administration and .... that create conditions of choice and freedom not only for "blue collar whites" but all poor, low-income, and middle class Americans, and less so for the rich who have the means, power, and income to provide for themself? I doubt it.

Will she as a white female, from rural small town America, be able to "relate" to the complex diversity, the complex issues, going on in America given its complex demographics, and also that of the geopolitical world ... or will she have to be trained, briefed, told what to do by the real power and decision-makers behind the scenes, using her as a token female figurehead ... old, white, elite patriarchial males? Yes, I'm 100% sure, the price she agree to pay for being given this peverted, hypocritical, superficial gender promotion.

Could she step into any major urban city, and "community organize" the homeless, poor, and low-income citizens (many who may not look like her skin complexion wise), HELL NO, even though she claims being a small-town mayor of 7,025 mostly vanilla persons requires more skills and responsibility than community organizing. If a white person offended me with this kind of "ignorant-vanilla-logic" BS it was HER. Most blacks MUST learn to adapt to mainstream (code word for WHITE) society. But I don't see Palin thinking and acting like any white person I'd want in my community -- doing, representing, organizing, or leading anything. And that's exactly why the RNC picked her ... because they know many white males and females, especially rednecks, bimbo-white females who think feminism is about body-parts, and so forth.

If feminism is about support, celebrating, and high-5-ing each other because any woman is picked by some elite patriarchy male to occupy a token position of power, as long as they do what the men tell them do, then I'll renounce my feminist support and devote my resources and smarts to ensuring the RNC achieves its insidious agenda, whether the RNC is lead by patriarch males or femaels, and that is return all women (excluding those in my group) back to the 16th century ... the domestic sphere, stripped all of rights except those that males "permit" them to have ... the real meaning of "freedom and choice" if you vote for McCain and Palin.

It blows my mind, no insults my intellect, that the RNC has the audacity to present themself (and McCain and Palin) as the Agents-of-Change. If there is nothing I've learned as a black male in America, it is when a white person is "co-opting" (aka stealing) someone else's ideas, values, achievements while simulatenously devaluing, denigrating, marginalizing the persons from who they stole it ... and this is the RNC MO.

Just like those fools voted George Bush into office for 8-years, and swore he was Ronald Regan reborn, I should hope America does not once against find itself duped, proven stupid ... except this time 151 million Women may pay the price in painfully learning McCain/Palin don't represent "freedom" and "choice" but the abdication of such, and not CHANGE but REGRESSION to 1950s values and patriachy.

I'm sorry. But this white female conservative has really pissed me off! Senator Obama graduate from Harvard Law. He was also the first black (bi-racial) to be elected to head the Law Review, one of the most difficult and coveted positions a law student in the world can get. His career, success, wealth was 100% guaranteed after such. He could have chosen to be a CEO. But instead he chose to go back and community organize in a Chicago urban city -- one that Palin wouldn't have a clue how to organize or lead. And, yes, Obama probably had before or after political aspirations. But then he could have joined the Republican Party, and translated his Ivy League education and skills into filthy, nasty, rich opportunism. But instead, he chose politics. There have been 43 white male elite Presidents in America since the 1789. I'd sure like to why milliions of Americans voted all these white males into the President if they have the skills to run a "diverse" nation, not simply represent the those Americans they look like. Obama (and even Hillary) are the 1st in American history to truly represent 300 million Americans, in substance and symbolically, to all of us and to the world. McCain and Palin have the audacity to pretend they're of the same diversity cloth, that they represent a departure from the status-quo elite white males, ISM values, of America. Pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeeee, how dammmmm gullible can one be! Obama and Biden have their shortcomings as males, and as professional politicians. But those shortcomings don't even compare to what McCain and Palin represent -- a RNC conference full of mostly mob-mentality, myopic-value, white folks (and a sprinkle of confused non-whites). And Rudy has the audacity to equate today's Republic Party, the GOP, the Republic (Lincoln) that facilitated the emancipation of Slaves -- OMG, what an insult! Talk about double-speak, talk about fallacious rhetoric, talk about speaking to every racist, redneck, bimbo-minded, white person in America: Please, vote for us. We represent YOU. We will PRESERVE your hegemonic beliefs .... white supremacy, patriachy, homophobia, and all else ... but we'll be covert about it. But, hey, just ignore my warning, just marginalize me as an "angry black man". But then if and after YOU elect these 2, watch how fast they start stripping women and minorities and the poor of any advancements in "choice" and "freedom" overnight! Watch how this nation REGRESSES back to the same tribal-wars we have been trapped in since America elected its few elite white male and 42 more afterwards -- including that poor excuse of a John Wayne drunk Bush. I apologize for my ad hominems abusives. But I'm feeling like "civility" and "intellect" and not what the RNC is about ... so why extend them such or those who support this lunacy.

My God. That speech is the most inelegant, spiteful, terrible speech I've ever wasted my lunch break listening to.

She makes me so angry, mostly because being in the UK means that I have to sit impotently aside and keep my fingers crossed that horribly simplistic ploys, lies and irrelevancies on the part of the Republican Party don't succeed.

One of my favorite writers, Connie Schultz, wrote a column about her that came out before the speech about her daughter.

http://www.cleveland.com/schultz/index.ssf?/base/living-0/122043076689550.xml&coll=2

My pitbull is offended to be associated with Sarah Palin LOL.

I wish people would stop touting her "experience." She's been governer for, what, a year, and the town she was mayor of is the size of my NEIGHBORHOOD. Who couldn't get that job done, FCOL? The comment about rubber stamping is correct--my father was on the TC of our town, and the mayor pretty much just has to wave from a convertible during the Christmas parade. He was a great guy, our mayor, but I wouldn't say he's qualified to run the entire country, LOL!!

And McCain just loves to crack on Obama's "lack of experience." Uh, you're a senator too, John, and your "experience" is only by default of being 900 years old.

I hate Republicans.

"It makes me sick that all the Republicans (and some Democrats) are saying that we shouldn't bring her children into the debate... that we can't criticize her daughter's pregnancy."

Um, you really should leave Bristol out of this. She's not running for VP her mom is.

Was anyone else just a bit bothered by the whole "Raising McCain" bit? Anyone see the movie Raising Cain? If not, this was about a man with multiple personality disorder that was going around killing people. What is the GOP trying to say through this slogan?

I have to say this here, as I said it in my blog, Palin is going around touting McCain as this high and mighty war hero and completely belittling the community organizer, but what these people don't seem to realize is that there is a war being waged right here on American soil and it's the community organizers who fight these battles on a daily basis. If you really want to get to the nuts and bolts of it, Obama is a war hero as well, for fighting the wars in the south side of Chicago, and he's fighting a war that everybody is a part of and one that affects everyone in this country in one way or another, not just a battle being waged overseas that was an incredibly unpopular war to begin with.

I don't like the Republicans, and I don't like Sarah Palin, who seems to me to be the Anti-woman with a self-serving agenda.

i didnt watch it. but a note on the baby-passing. there are two very good reasons for it.

1) at 4m, babies can become very unsettled by noise and lights. he may have been passed around so much because he was becoming overwhelmed by the stimulation. also, it was pretty late for a baby to be awake. being passed around to keep him consoled for a little bit.

2) in general, people like holding babies, especially when they are bored. they'd rather focus and play with a baby than listen to an, i gather, underwhelming speech. the camera people where probably scanning the crowd looking for interesting things to look at and were simply attracted to the movement.theyd rather show that than people bored, or talking to their neighbour or doodling. i did see a little clip this morning with newt gingrich and he looked unimpressed.

Great comments from everyone. One thing that I haven't seen mentioned yet that particularly bothered was Palin's and Giuliano's rhetoric of "victory" in Iraq. Maybe I am just ignorant, but what would victory in Iraq look like, exactly? Considering our reasons for going to Iraq in the first place have been shown to be totally bogus, what are we still hoping to accomplish? If they're just talking about setting up a stable state in Iraq, why use the word "victory?" Or do they mean just killing all the terrorists?
Like most of Palin's speech, the mentions of victory seemed hollow, meaningless, and out of touch.

Moving away from Governor Palin's gender and her family, there were glaring factual errors in her speech: From the article by Associated Press Writer Jim Drinkard at http://www.comcast.net/articles/news-politics/20080903/CVN.Fact.Check/

PALIN: "I have protected the taxpayers by vetoing wasteful spending ... and championed reform to end the abuses of earmark spending by Congress. I told the Congress 'thanks but no thanks' for that Bridge to Nowhere."

THE FACTS: As mayor of Wasilla, Palin hired a lobbyist and traveled to Washington annually to support earmarks for the town totaling $27 million. In her two years as governor, Alaska has requested nearly $750 million in special federal spending, by far the largest per-capita request in the nation. While Palin notes she rejected plans to build a $398 million bridge from Ketchikan to an island with 50 residents and an airport, that opposition came only after the plan was ridiculed nationally as a "bridge to nowhere."

There is more of course. The questions we need to look at are integrity, political spin-doctoring, and knowledge of issues.

i was raised by my mother's family, which is one of the most prominent alaskan settler families. my family's archives, going back six generations, are in the alaska state library. (one of my ancestors was the first female postmaster general of any state or territory, so our alaskan feminist cred is real!)

and unlike this pretender, MY FAMILY ACTUALLY WANTED ALASKA TO BE A FRIGGIN' STATE.

now i live in arizona. on behalf of my state, i want to apologize for inflicting john mccain on all of you. please, feel free to flog me all you like. we deserve it.

I am a lifelong feminist, daughter of a feminist mother. Feminism is not some vague "supporting women's choices", theogirl. After all, to take an extreme example, there are women in the Ku Klux Klan and the Nazis had women's organizations. I sure don't support women's choices to join such groups. It's about advancing equality for all women (not just an opportunity for oneself), and a better world for women and men and children (animals, plants, etc.) Nothing I heard in Palin's speech, and nothing in her record, shows me she would do or has done any of this.

The fact is, Sarah Palin and John McCain are all about denying choices to women. I hear that she is proud her daughter chose to have her baby, but she does not want women to be able to make that choice. The daughter should not be an issue, but...The Obama girls are only 7 and 10, but can you imagine, CAN YOU IMAGINE, the reaction if they'd been older, in their teens, and while Obama was planning his run for the presidency, knowing he'd be in full media spotlight, one of them got pregnant by a trash-talking profanity spewing young Black man who was a legal adult, even if barely, while she was a minor? Do I even need to ask what the reaction would be from Coulter, O'Reilly, Hannity, Limbaugh and the Republican establishment?

In her speech I heard nothing about economy, nothing about housing, nothing about health care, nothing about Iraq, nothing about foreign relations generally, nothing about childcare.

Equality also means women can't ask for special rules. If a man with her resume, her history of crookedness, her hard right politics were nominated after the briefest of vettings, wouldn't questions be raised? It was hilarious watching the Daily Show with Jon Stewart. He played clips of Dick Morris and various talking heads slamming Hillary Clinton for alleging sexism, mocking her, ridiculing her in the most misogynist terms, and now the same people are saying criticizing Palin is sexist.

Sarah Palin is to Hillary Clinton as Clarence Thomas is to Thurgood Marshall.

So good to hear from other Alaskan Girls!

Taxes were clearly explained but didn't mention the most recent kick-back of $1200. This is Palin mimicking Bush's economic stimulus check. All residents who qualified for the PFD will also get this kick-back cash at the end of the month. This would be Palin's speech statement about cutting out pet projects and giving the money back to the people. Ya, some ppl will be able to off-set their fuel budget, but I'm a year-round bike commuter so I'm gonna go on vacation. I will donate some of the cash, maybe to a bush village...

Speaking of bush villages...did you know Venezuelan company, Houston based, Citgo gave heating oil to some bush villages last year? So whereas Palin is abandoning her state while a significant part of the population is facing economic crisis in figuring out how not to freeze to death this winter... the "friend of our enemies" is willing to step in and help a commoner out.

I didn't get to all of the comments, but I tried to read most. I saw a little bit discussed about the whole sexism play in the media and republican party, but I was curious what people thought about it. Do you think it's sexist?

First, let me say that I do think the whole discussion of whether Sarah Palin "has time" to be VP with all of her motherhood responsibilities is sexist. I think it is quite obvious that this concern is never brought up in the face of male candidates (Obama included who has two small children of his own).

At the same time, I think we as a nation should address the realities and causes of this sexism. First, even in the most liberal of households, where women work full-time and are the bread winners, the moms still bear the brunt of parenting and household work. This "double bind" has been researched and discussed at length, particularly within feminism. The struggle and associated guilt of balancing work and home is a major issue unique to women.

Now is this fair or right? Absolutely not. But I think it answers why people are prone to ask Palin that question before Obama.

I also think IT IS somewhat of a legitimate question to ask Sarah Palin, as she has identified herself as a "hockey mom" time and time again. There are different parenting styles...Many moms utilize a traditionally male approach, where parenting is simply one part of their life but not the entire picture. These moms (and dads) usually find solace in working away from home and utilize a more communal approach to parenting, where family, friends and other parents take part in raising the child. These are not hockey moms. Hockey moms are the super-involved parents who drive their children everywhere, attend every event, join the PTA, become leaders/coaches, etc. -- they identify mostly by their role as a mother and openly prioritize their family over their work.

So if Sarah Palin is that type of mother, becoming VP, and potentially President of the United States, might create some sort of a conflict.

Am I implying that Sarah Palin can't be Vice President because of her family? No. But I am defending where this sentiment is coming from and hoping that it will create a little more discourse, and a lot less finger pointing.

I am just horrified that she might be the next VP. I don't need to repeat what everyone else has said, but know I am another voice saying, Palin is not good for women or for the country (nor is mccain)!

gloria steinem on palin: http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-steinem4-2008sep04,0,7915118.story

fact-checking article showing some of the lies the republicans told last night:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080904/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_fact_check

oh, and if sarah palin was more interested in reading books rather than banning them (HOLY SHIT), maybe she would read about my ancestors, how they worked to bring alaska into the union, and what real frontier strength of character means. i remember my (very conservative) alaskan grandfather telling me, "freedon OF religion also means freedom FROM religion".

she made me want to punch my television. and i just bought a really nice, new television.

god, this woman makes me sick.

My friends and I played a drinking game while watching Palin's speech:

1. Every time she mentions McCain being a POW, take a drink. (This was the one that killed us.)
2. Every time she mentions drilling, take a drink.
3. Every time she mentions lowering taxes, take a drink.
4. Every time we spot a person of color in the audience, take a drink. You can only count a person once, since the networks tended to show the same POC over and over again.

Also, when Palin mentioned her son being deployed overseas, they cut back to show him, and he looked INCREDIBLY uncomfortable. I wonder why. Perhaps he doesn't like being reminded he's being sent into a war zone?

I dunno, I mean, I'm pretty young, but I went to law school, I make pretty good money right now, and Obama's proposed tax plan would be equivalent to me getting my salary cut by like 20%. It's sort of like, would I pay $30,000 for all the things we'd lose if McCain gets elected? I dunno. Maybe?

the flash, if you're making so much that you'd get a tax increase from obama's plan, you're in the top 5% of incomes. five. percent. forgive me if i'm just not all that sad for you.

also, obama's plan essentially brings taxes on the wealthiest americans back to what they were under clinton in the 90s. bush just gave tax cuts out to rich people like candy, so if you had been in the same spot ten plus years ago, you would have been paying more taxes. it helps to think of obama's plan as a rollback of crazy bush regime tax breaks rather than "raising taxes."

Weirdly enough, that does help a little.

Also, I wasn't looking for sympathy. I was looking for someone to, er, convince me?

The Flash,

From this http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080904/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_fact_check

"The Tax Policy Center, a think tank run jointly by the Brookings Institution and the Urban Institute, concluded that Obama's plan would increase after-tax income for middle-income taxpayers by about 5 percent by 2012, or nearly $2,200 annually. McCain's plan, which cuts taxes across all income levels, would raise after tax-income for middle-income taxpayers by 3 percent, the center concluded.

Obama would provide $80 billion in tax breaks, mainly for poor workers and the elderly, including tripling the Earned Income Tax Credit for minimum-wage workers and higher credits for larger families.

He also would raise income taxes, capital gains and dividend taxes on the wealthiest. He would raise payroll taxes on taxpayers with incomes above $250,000, and he would raise corporate taxes. Small businesses that make more than $250,000 a year would see taxes rise."

Also from here http://www.nypost.com/seven/06142008/news/nationalnews/obama_tax_plan_raises_big_bracket_115443.htm
"A worker making $200,000 a year would pay no additional payroll taxes under Obama's plan. But anyone making $250,000 a year or more would pay 6.2 percent in payroll taxes on their entire income - not just on their first $102,000."

I am always flabbergasted by a woman who runs with a party that has always been against most women's rights. I wonder if Sarah Palin will wear a pants suit ever... or has she already? Lol.

A few months ago, all the uber-liberal elite law school recent grads were sent into hysterics of identity crisis when they were faced with this calculation on a popular lawyer blog:

http://www.abovethelaw.com/2008/02/obama_biglaw_and_taxesor_obama_1.php

It basically amounts to telling first-year lawyers that they're going to get a pay cut of $34k.

But I know that Obama's tax plan has changed since, and it isn't really going to be that drastic. It was just jarring at the time, and leaves a lot of lefty lawyers, like me, feeling like we have to make something along the lines of Sophie's choice: My Starbucks or my soul? i'm not saying that we deserve any sympathy, but we also don't deserve opprobrium for feeling like, y'know, I just started getting this pay check and all of a sudden it's going to shrink a whole lot, and that's kind of tough to take, so, any political plan that can accomodate me... like Obama's doughnut hole... is cause for celebration, if you feel like you can actually rely on it.

I think we should also understand that first year law students are (presumably) paying an insane amount of student loans, so a giant pay cut for them would matter. Does anybody know if that will be taken into account with Obama's tax plan?

In general, I do think Americans (and people) need to focus more on the "REDUCE" part of the old reduce, reuse, recycle. We buy so much crap we don't need (and end up wasting), while millions of people here and abroad do without. I think a lot of us need to put things in perspective. Yes, I love going out to eat, and buying new clothes, and traveling, and would love to own a lakehouse, BUT is any of that really necessary? And will I degrade others to have it? Nope.

"And McCain just loves to crack on Obama's "lack of experience." Uh, you're a senator too, John, and your "experience" is only by default of being 900 years old.

I hate Republicans."

friendlyfeminist you literally made me LOL at work with your post. it is especially funny because i am surrounded by old fart republicans!

Are we really criticizing this woman's ACCENT?! Are we really using words like "baby-daddy" and "whoring out?"

This thread is pathetic. I can't believe some of the comments I'm reading on here.

And I really take issue with the comment about income. I was a single mom for 10 years (just got married in May). I worked HARD to get where I am--I paid for school myself and worked the entire time I was in it. It took me 8 years to graduate, and when I did, I got a job that didn't even cover me paycheck to paycheck. After 5 years, I'm finally making a salary on which my daughter and I can live comfortably, I give more than 10 percent of my income to various charities, and I'm supposed to feel GUILTY? I don't think so. I feel strong and empowered that I did all these things on my own and that I can provide for my daughter. The amount of taxes I pay in one year could pay for one year of her college education. What kind of 'choice' is that?

Oh, and my conservative Christian parents actually offered to take out a loan (they don't have much money) to help out if I chose NOT to marry the a-hole. Of course, I was an idiot and didn't take them up on it (married for a year and a half, then divorced). So please stop generalizing about Christians.

Theogirl, you said:

Feminism is supposed to be about defying stereotypes and rejecting imposed standards.

Actually, no. What you just described is more akin to what women must often do in order to flout or, sometimes, succeed in the face of sexism.

Feminism is about something very simple, at least from the perspective of a lawmaker: Affording women the same rights and opportunities as men are afforded and ensuring that those rights and opportunities are legally protected from ingrained or institutionalized discrimination.

Sarah Palin fails on the feminist front not just in her opposition to public health programs -- I can understand libertarian-style oppositions to programs that might raise taxes -- but more egregiously in her desire to restrict legally granted rights to plan their own families and to sue over wage discrimination.

what scares me is how liberals are now acting like conservatives. this thread is a perfect example. You don't believe in a womans choice unless it's a choice you agree with. You are attacking everything about this woman in an EXTREMELY sexist manner. I have even heard feminists, or rather "feminists" talk about how can she POSSIBLY handle being a mother and a VP. or even chastising her for going back to work 3 days after her son was born. or how someone here was basically like, wow, did you see he daughter roll her eyes when she mentioned it doesnt take her away from the family. if this was hillary, or ANY democratic woman, you would be up in ARMS about this kind of behavior. where are the principles here people? because instead of principles, i see many dems making themselves out to be hypocrites. Its a sad day in american politics in general.

also the part about obama authoring two memoirs but NOT A SINGLE LAW. yeah, that should scare any obama supporter. the guy is smoke and mirrors. That being said, I dont like the mccain ticket either so, come november, things should get interesting. That being said, Palin has only exposed the dems as being hypocritical and whiny, no better then the republicans. if you ask me, everyone has let the country down.

Katie, I don't know that it's fair to hold all liberals' or feminists' feet to the fire just because a few people have gone off the reservation about a woman only marginally more accomplished (and in some respects less accomplished) than Lynne Spears.

I don't think anyone here at feministing would criticize her for pursuing a career while having a family, or would criticize her for deciding to bring a fetus that would have downs' syndrome to term. What I, and many others, WOULD criticize her for is that her decisions have been made easier because of government programs and social structures that she actively works against, and her political actions make it more difficult for similarly situated women with equal amoutns of intelligence, dedication and talent, to accomplish what she has accomplished.

Hey, "Katie", or Steve, or whoever you are-

Take the accusations of sexism back to the Fox News threads. And tell you bosses at the McCain campaign not to bother trolling feministing.com - you're wasting your time here.

the flash, thanks for clarifying. i understand and now that you linked that abovethelaw piece that makes more sense as to why you had initial cause for concern.

as an uber-elite recent law grad myself, i'm prone to paranoia when contemplating giving up starbucks to pay sallie mae. especially since i'm not a biglaw associate pulling 160k+. not even close!

but now that you've seen the latest of his tax plan, please tell all your similarly situated lawyer friends! the last thing we need is for young lefties who find themselves in a relatively high tax bracket to start flipping out thinking that voting their conscience in every other way is going to get them foreclosed upon. or even mean trading in that new 3-series for a kia. (sorry, you probably don't drive a black 3-series, so it wasn't meant as a slight, but you probably know what i'm talking about).

I can get behind that idea Flash. and thats frankly what i would rather hear that then anything relating to how annoying her voice is, or her daughter, or other things i regard as sexist. It's just disappointing to me how many "liberals" have been saying this on the news and other places. even just from talking to people. To me it's just exactly what republicans do, and that scares me. Here's the other thing, I really, really dont think any dem can bring up lack of experience. The fact is, you can disagree with her stances, bc there is more then enough to disagree with there. but please, PLEASE don't go around saying that obama has been successful in any sort of governing. he has never written a law, he had one of the worst attendance records in the senate, he comes from one of the most corrupt political machines in the country, and frankly, HES DONE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. It scares me that he's all talk, because it seems to me like hes gotten here on that alone, and if he hasn't done anything in the past, i am unsure as to why anyone in this country thinks he would start now?

thats off topic, but just really another reason why i find this election terrifying on both levels.

Also, I think perhaps that Palin's candidacy scares feminists and liberals bc it proves that oh yeah here is a woman that is part of the patriarchy, gunning for their values, yet has made it this far. doing all the things despite us saying that there are too many obstacles, obstacles that evidently she doesnt help break down. doesnt do much for our argument, that much i will say.

I can get behind that idea Flash. and thats frankly what i would rather hear that then anything relating to how annoying her voice is, or her daughter, or other things i regard as sexist. It's just disappointing to me how many "liberals" have been saying this on the news and other places. even just from talking to people. To me it's just exactly what republicans do, and that scares me. Here's the other thing, I really, really dont think any dem can bring up lack of experience. The fact is, you can disagree with her stances, bc there is more then enough to disagree with there. but please, PLEASE don't go around saying that obama has been successful in any sort of governing. he has never written a law, he had one of the worst attendance records in the senate, he comes from one of the most corrupt political machines in the country, and frankly, HES DONE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. It scares me that he's all talk, because it seems to me like hes gotten here on that alone, and if he hasn't done anything in the past, i am unsure as to why anyone in this country thinks he would start now?

thats off topic, but just really another reason why i find this election terrifying on both levels.

Also, I think perhaps that Palin's candidacy scares feminists and liberals bc it proves that oh yeah here is a woman that is part of the patriarchy, gunning for their values, yet has made it this far. doing all the things despite us saying that there are too many obstacles, obstacles that evidently she doesnt help break down. doesnt do much for our argument, that much i will say.

Jon Stewart of "The Daily Show" shows how conservatives are changing their tunes - criticisms for Democratic choices from 1 month ago are now praises for Republican choices, and this includes Palin saying that if you can't play with the big boys get out of the game and then turning around and blasting the media for making a circus of her. It's rather funny.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/09/04/jon-stewart-hits-karl-rov_n_123852.html

Uh.

No one in 225 years of American history has ever "cleaned up Washington". Don't you, like, want someone who knows how to work within corrupt political structures to try and achieve something? Like, maybe a guy who worked his way through Chicago to get somewhere? Y'know, not, like, someone who sat in a snow drift with her 7,999 friends and then lucked out on pursuing the governorship at a time when the entrenched powers had bungled things a little too badly? I mean, she's been something more than mayor of a tiny hamlet for only two years. Does she, like, know how to jaywalk?

Also, why does everyone keep comparing her to Obama, and not to Biden? Could it be because she's so painfully unimpressive and ill-suited to the job compared to Biden?

I wish obama had picked hillary for vp. I'd loved to have seen her debate pallin.

Bee,

WTH are you talking about? A simple text search of this page shows that “baby-daddy” and “whoring out” are not mentioned anywhere on this thread. Were some people commenting on accent? Yes, but even I dislike McCain’s accent because when I listen to him speak, he sounds like Bush.

And what comment about income? Are you saying that you ARE in the top 5% of Americans? Well that’s nice for you. Just FYI, we all work hard to make our lives better. What makes your hardships any more deserving of sympathy than someone else who makes less money than you?

Also, no you are not supposed to feel guilty, you are supposed to recognize that this world that you depend on is forged on the backs of low income workers. If you deny the interconnectedness of us all you doom yourself to a worse life.

And what generalizing about Christians? That many Christians are nice, caring people? But that Christianity is full of patriarchal values? That most Christians want to have control over all women’s bodies? But, again, I didn’t really see that in this thread.

katie,

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080904/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_fact_check

PALIN: "There is much to like and admire about our opponent. But listening to him speak, it's easy to forget that this is a man who has authored two memoirs but not a single major law or reform — not even in the state senate."

THE FACTS: Compared to McCain and his two decades in the Senate, Obama does have a more meager record. But he has worked with Republicans to pass legislation that expanded efforts to intercept illegal shipments of weapons of mass destruction and to help destroy conventional weapons stockpiles. The legislation became law last year. To demean that accomplishment would be to also demean the work of Republican Sen. Richard Lugar of Indiana, a respected foreign policy voice in the Senate. In Illinois, he was the leader on two big, contentious measures in Illinois: studying racial profiling by police and requiring recordings of interrogations in potential death penalty cases. He also successfully co-sponsored major ethics reform legislation.

Had Obama picked Hillary, McCain probably would not have chosen Palin.

Also, The Flash,

Well, a few reasons why Palin and Obama's "experience" is being compared.
1. They are about the same age (Palin is 3 years younger), so they should have about the same amount of years of experience. They both entered the public realm in about 1996. (But the quality of those experiences is drastic. Palin as mayor from '96-'02 of the 7,000 people town. Obama as State Legislator from '97-'04. To me legislator >> mayor of tiny town.)
2. McCain is OLD. He could die while in office, and the best person he could get for the job was Sarah Palin.
3. On the experience ticket, Palin can't compare to Biden, so the GOP goes after Obama.

wickedwench,

I didn't like what you had to say, the VOICE, the BITTERNESS,.... wow, are you serious?! I don't support Palin because she doesn't support women (and because of her many other positions on issues). but please let's not get all sexist on her. we can be more creative...

Jessica,

I loved your comment: "I was too focused on the baby-passing choreography." It caught my attention too;) and how they made sure the baby faced the camera at all times,...

I want to declare that if McCain wins, I will have to do something drastic, like move to mars or something. (where I would hope to have someone read my rights to me if I get arrested!)

and last night I found out that apparently Palin is a major shit-talker!

Femgineer,

Next time, do some careful reading instead of a quick text search:

-missouri_misery posted, on September 4, 2008 2:51 AM

1) Her children looked moderately terrified and genuinely uncomfortable when their mom pimped them out in front of a prime time audience, case in point:

2) Daughter Bristol and her baby-daddy clinging awkwardly to each other like an 80 year old couple in a church service.

-wickedwench posted, on September 3, 2008 10:57 PM

Maybe it's my Boston eardrums encountering her strong pronunciation of Rs, but she sounds like the school secretary in Ferris Bueller.

-Lauren posted, on September 4, 2008 3:11 AM

Has anyone seen the movie "Drop Dead Gorgeous"?
If so, you will understand me when I say that Palin is totally the St. Paul Pork Products Lady--- "I love it so much, I WORK HERE NOW!"

LOh my gosh, you're so right!
Palin really did sound like she had a suppressed Minnesotan (spelling?) accent.
And now I can't stop laughing because I'm imagining Palin, holding sausages and wearing slaughter-house gear, saying, "I love it so much, I WORK HERE NOW!"

So that's WTH I am talking about. Although I do concede that I used "whoring" instead of "pimping" erroneously. Sorry. And I'm not even criticizing their use toward Sarah Palin. I'm sure she can take it. I'm talking about how these terms are offensive to womnen in general.

And my comment about income was in response to
"the flash, if you're making so much that you'd get a tax increase from obama's plan, you're in the top 5% of incomes. five. percent. forgive me if i'm just not all that sad for you." I don't feel like cutting and pasting you said it...look it up yourself.

I am not in the top 5 percent. But I have a good salary and pay way too much in taxes. It IS nice for me, especially because of how hard I worked to get here. I am in no way saying my hardships are more deserving of sympathy than anyone else's. I NEVER said that. Quite the opposite--I don't WANT anyone's sympathy. I don't now, I didn't then. What I do want is for people to quit judging me and others like myself for achieving. Nothing was handed to me.

Suppose I recognize that this world I depend on is forge on the backs of low income workers. Having been one, am I supposed to apologize for changing my position? Do I want to help others? Yes. And I do. And I can even do it all by myself, without the government telling me to.

I'm referring to the generalizing about Christians that says they're trying to push marriage on pregnant teens.

I have to say that that piece from the Daily Show on the double talk of Republicans was priceless and hilarious.

I've seen time after time today news people saying "They would never ask a man whether their families will be taken care of if they are elected." Look, the fact is that mothers are usually the primary cargivers of a couple's children. Whether that's right or wrong, or it needs to be changed, it's the truth for the majority of heterosexual parenting couples. So when men run for office who have young children, we assume they will be taken care of by their mothers.

When a women like Sarah Palin, with an infant child and another young child, runs for office, we don't assume that her husband will automatically stay home and raise the baby. So we then ask, who will be taking care of her children? The fact is, she won't be taking care of her baby if she becomes VP. She won't have enough time. It's got to be and 80 hour a week or more job with lots of travel and meetings. And unlike in Alaska, she won't be able to put the crib next to her desk. This of course presupposes that McCain will actually give her a job to do, which I'm not so sure of, because she's not qualified to do much anyways, with little to no national issue experience.

But regardless of who is raising her children we all know that she has the family support and money to make sure her baby and young daughter are well taken care of. I'd appreciate if she'd actually own the fact that she's making a career move that with make her sacrifice time with her family because this is a once in a lifetime career opportunity.

Bee,

I did read the entire comments, but I guess what bothered you didn’t stick out to me. And I must have spelled "daddy" wrong in my search. Woops. Baby-daddy is degrading to women? I suppose in the case of Bristol and Levi, “fiancé” would have been more appropriate, but what if a woman’s baby’s father isn’t a boyfriend or husband or fiancé of the woman. Is baby’s father ok, but not baby-daddy?

But, I think you are right, some of this shit on this thread is petty and not the epitome of intelligent conversation.

What people are judging you for achieving? And how? The comment you took issue with said that the person was just not that sad that a person in the top 5% of incomes is going to have to pay more in taxes. Because you do not belong to that group, what is the problem.

I have nothing to say about Christians and “shot gun weddings”. I have no expertise on whether it is a fair generalization or not. Maybe Bristol wanted to get married to Levi and got pregnant on purpose.

Katie - Obama's Senate record is roughly on par with other first-term Senators in terms of legislation that they sponsored actually getting passed. But he's actually sponsored and co-sponsored far more bills than any of the Republican Senators whose terms also began in 2005. I just wrote about this on my blog (which I attempt to link in my name).

I can't believe this woman is even being taken seriously...I wouldn't even vote for her to head the PTA.

@ Bee:

My comment about Palin's accent was irrelevant and immature, but it didn't actually criticize Palin or her accent. I simply thought it was funny that someone connected her to that movie and commented on that.

I'm sorry that my comment upset you so much, though, and you are right, we shouldn't be talking about her accent. Although, some people have said it's sexist to talk about her accent, which I don't agree with, since people have criticized plenty of male candidates and Presidents for their accents and speech patterns. It's an irrelevant and unimportant topic, but it's not sexist.

Between her RHC speech last night, and the sound bites floating around internet-land from today's round of speeches, I'm convinced that Sarah Palin is just a pretty mean girl who has been fortunate enough not to have outgrown her high school popularity. I cannot image why else, given her rock-solid beliefs on healthcare, reproductive and welfare issues, war, drilling, etc., she would stick with snide namecalling and smirking for the camera.

She's just that pretty, evil girl who tortured the kids outside of her clique, married a stud and popped out a bunch of kids. She just happened to get the veep nomination.

Between her RHC speech last night, and the sound bites floating around internet-land from today's round of speeches, I'm convinced that Sarah Palin is just a pretty mean girl who has never left her home sphere and has therefore been fortunate enough not to have outgrown her high school popularity. I cannot image why else, given her rock-solid beliefs on healthcare, reproductive and welfare issues, war, drilling, etc., she would stick with snide namecalling and smirking for the camera.

She's just that pretty, evil girl who tortured the kids outside of her clique, married her high school stud and popped out a bunch of kids. She just happened to get the veep nomination.

as a woman, a mother, a christian, a graduate student, a new yorker and an arizonan (of alaskan descent).....i have never been more sickened by a candidate than i am by sarah palin.

heading to the obama site to donate......

We all know that the pit bull with lipstick remark is offensive to women. But it is also offensive to pit bull owners. It is enforcing the stereotype that all pit bulls are fierce and out of control. I'm not a pit bull owner but I do have a chow, a breed that has a similar reputation, so I really feel for them. Many pit bulls are very sweet. My area has a ban on pit bulls and I feel that is wrong. If they go after pit bulls my sweetheart of a chow could be next.

Um.

Toni...

Really?

**I like your response Flash LOL**

One, I'd like to address the "experience" issue. Yes, Obama is a little light on governmental experience... and maybe not as starkly different from Palin as he should be, but the two are nowhere near comparable. Pre-politics Obama went to harvard law school and worked as a community organizer. Sarah Palin got a communications degree and worked as a sport broadcaster. I mean, come on!

Also, Bee...that's great that you worked your butt off to succeed but that doesn't mean that you didn't have opportunities that others of a different race, ethnicity, social background, etc. might not have. My mom was a single mother who got pregnant in high school, didn't have a college degree and received zero assistance (both financially or other). She is now a VP at a giant company. I know how hard she worked to get there. At the same time, if she were a black woman with no social or family connections, she probably wouldn't be where she is. EVERYONE needs to be aware of and acknowledge their privileges, no matter how hard they worked.

I would like to go on record as holding the belief that Sarah Palin's pitbull metaphor did not automatically create or try to reinforce a feeling that women are (like) dogs, except in the very obvious intentional way.

There is already so much damage being inflicted on language and meaning during this election and its coverage. Let's not lose the plot entirely.

I, also, would like to buy the vote of an American who doesn't intend to so that I can do my bit for sanity. Any takers?

You know, the more I think about this "don't bring up her family" stuff, the more ridiculous I think it is.

Republicans have been going on and on about "family values" for as long as I can remember. And of course, by family values, they mean things like women staying at home to take care of the kids and cook and clean. Family values is supposed to mean instilling one's kids with a rock-solid aversion to sex before marriage, too. So by their own standards, Palin is a failure. Why is it hypocritical of us to point that out?

The GOP (and McCain/Palin) are stategic-smart. They know what is at stake -- POWER TO CONTROL the daily lives of 303 million Americans -- and influence the 7 billion lives in the world. So, given the stats of white females in America, does it not surprise us that McCain nominated Palin (a white female) as his VP to get the highest percentage of white female voters out of 82 million. He knows Obama/Biden will win if these get these votes -- for the votes of all males and non-white females won't decide the race. Hillary knew this. Thus the GOP pandering to women in gender, but a particular demographic of women. The GOP fully understands the POWER of WOMEN (in particular that of 82 million) in America. So, yes, we can critique him and Palin in cyberspace. But we all know the GOP is playing serious gender divisive politics in the real world -- and Palin may win this status-quo power-game for him. And, yes, her reward will be to get into the world-history-books as the first female of America to serve in the VP slot, second only to the Presidency. Can you see her long term career Presidential plans after McCain is gone in 4 or 8 years, lol:)

21,540,978.00 - White Males (ages 0-17)
76,356,495.00 - White Males (ages 18-100)
97,897,473.00 - Total White Males (ages 0-100)

20,434,619.00 - White Females (ages 0-17)
81,029,255.00 - White Females (ages 18-100)
101,463,874.00 - Total White Females (ages 0-100)

5,455,359.00 - Black Males (ages 0-17)
12,276,380.00 - Black Males (ages 18-100)
17,731,739.00 - Total Black Males (ages 0-100)

5,295,225.00 - Black Females (ages 0-17)
14,188,247.00 - Black Females (ages 18-100)
19,483,472.00 - Total Black Females (ages 0-100)

149,341,077.00 - All U.S. Males (0-100)
153,580,349.00 - All U.S. Females (0-100)
302,921,426.00 - Total U.S. (0-100)

While I agree that a candidate's family should be off limits (even though you know Republicans would have been all over it if a Dem's teen was expecting), I really do wish the Republicans would quit trying to turn the fact that Sarah Palin is a mother into some sort of qualification for VP. If she continues to use her motherhood as something that makes her qualified, then she shouldn't be surprised or offended when people question her success as a mother and how becoming a VP will conflict with that role.

Note: I'm a mom and I believe I'm a good one, but I don't think the fact that I am one of the two people that raise my children makes me qualified to do anything other than raise children. It's the same with candidates.

Amber,

What opportunities do you think I had that others don't? I had no social or family connections either--my parents did not pay for my school, I lived on my own, etc. Just wondering (seriously). Although this probably isn't the appropriate thread to continue this discussion on, but hope you'll forgive me.

To The Flash:

Of course. Pit bulls are the most commonly abused breed which is why several are vicious. The stereotype has caused laws that require people to euthanize their pit bulls even though they never hurt anyone. A dog shouldn't put down because another one of the same breed bit someone. This is a stereotype that shouldn't be enforced because then more people believe all pit bulls are vicious and support the forced euthanization of dogs that did no harm. I certainly wouldn't appreciate it if someone said my dog must be vicious simply because he is a chow (which has a similar reputation as pit bulls) so I can imagine the same goes for pit bull owners.