There is a psychological phenomenon known as the "diffusion of responsibility" which means that the more people around, the less likely you are to get help. A famous example of this is Kitty Genovese. I think it's important to take the initiative. Don't assume somebody else is already going to help. I've never been in that situation, but I've always thought that if I were, I would call the police, then knock on the door (or approach the couple) and inform them that I have called the police, I would also have pepper spray at the ready, etc, in case the asshole decided to attack me too.

That's a really tough issue. Knowing when to intervene can be so tricky. It's one thing intervening in a public street brawl, but what do you do when there aren't many people around and there may be a chance you are putting yourself in danger? Or if the place is crowded and there are people standing watching?

I passed a full-on fight between a male and female teenager one day in broad daylight not too long ago on a street in Dublin. There was actually a crowd gathered just watching like it was some kind of boxing match and I couldn't believe it. I knew there were gardaí (police officers) around the corner as I had just passed them and ran back around a told them. And they went off in the direction of the fight - but I have no idea what happened next. I felt guilty for not immediately intervening. However, the reason I didn't intervene was because I knew of someone (a few years ago now) who had witnessed a man viciously beating up his female partner on the street and he went and intervened on her behalf - he ended up being told to f*ck off - by her. And then stabbed - by her.

My immediate feeling is to intervene in stuff like this but it is such a dodgy area, it really is hard to know what to do.

PS. I'm not making any comment with regard to the fact the guy I knew of got stabbed by the woman. It could just have easily been the man had there been a few different moves pulled or whatever, I was just making the point about safety for yourself in interventions etc...

I have story about a time when I didn't intervene.
When I was in grad school in Louisiana, I lived alone. At least twice a week I would hear the couple next door fighting. There was lots of yelling, and sometimes the sounds of something large hitting the wall. I often thought about calling the police, but never made that call. I justified my inaction by telling myself that if the man ever found out I was the tipster, he might come after me. I was afraid, and I am ashamed that I never tried to help the woman next door. In the two years that I lived there, we never spoke. I don't know what became of her, but I pray that she came across someone braver than I.

It does remind me of this horrible story from this week: http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/nationworld/sns-ap-woman-stabbed,0,5277809.story

I don't have a story, but I can't help but think about what they taught us growing up in health class and sex education: If you're being attacked in public, you aren't suppossed to cry "Rape" because it's proven that in all likely hood no one will attempt to help you. You are instead to cry, "Fire" because apparently that's something more people are likely to respond to.

That has always boggled my mind a little...

I'll get involved every time. I also have the privilege, in this situation, of being a stocky 5'll. Not many guys want to get into a fight with a woman their own size. (I also have a loud mouth and some martial arts training.)

I don't think I could not call the police in the example the woman studies used about her sister. Let's say I heard it, didn't call and he killed her, I'd feel guilty the rest of my life. If I knew he'd beat her worse when the police left, I would TELL them that when I called and they could take that into account when they intervened. If he continued beating her after they left, I would call the police AGAIN. I'll grant I have an uncommon trust in cops because my dad's a cop, I grew up with them. But really, what better things do they have to do than prevent a woman from possibly being beaten to death?

The responsibility to act goes beyond trusting a woman to judge her situation. Saying she should blames the victim into being in some sort of control and able to judge it accurately. Logically, that assumes women who have been killed or disabled by their partners didn't do a good enough job. I can't abide that, and I won't be complicit in someone's destructive behaviors.

I don't have a story, but I can't help but think about what they taught us growing up in health class and sex education: If you're being attacked in public, you aren't suppossed to cry "Rape" because it's proven that in all likely hood no one will attempt to help you. You are instead to cry, "Fire" because apparently that's something more people are likely to respond to.

That has always boggled my mind a little...

my neighbor upstairs is a single mother with an abusive ex. the man also happens to be the father of her son. he beat her so bad she screamed one night, and the uncertainty of what to do is killer sometimes. at that point, i knew nothing more of her than the sounds i heard through the ceiling.

i picked up the phone to call the cops, and realized i didn't know her apartment number. i tossed my husband the phone and pulled on my shoes to go find out.

he had left already. she stumbled out as i approached the door, and i ended up staying the night to help her feel safer. my husband and i chased him off later that night when he returned.

the cops were fucking useless. and the landlords sent her a letter threatening to throw her out if she screams again. "disturbing the peace." people suck.

Instead of calling police on neighbors, maybe people should call a battered woman's help line. They might have some good advice on how to help the victim without calling the police. It won't help that night when you hear the battering, but you will have strategies to use when you run into her (or him) in the hall or on the street. Some victims aren't ready to hear that they need help, and might even send the police away.

@Roni:

Women stay in abusive relationships for a large number of complex reasons. What you judge as one person's destructive behavior (ie, not calling police) might actually be their lifesaving strategy. You can't tell because you are not her.

When I was living in France, I happened upon men in the act of beating their partners (presumably) a few times over a short period. Once, it was going on right in front of a police station. My friend and I ducked inside and told the officer at the front desk, who said they'd file a report. When we protested that he should go outside and handle it, that his very presence and gaze on the scene would more than likely stop the violence, the officer firmly responded that he would file a report. It was absolutely infuriating. Another time, one of my friends approached a man who was holding a woman by the arm and repeatedly slapping her. The man turned on my friend, pushed him, and threatened to bring all of his friends from the army to kick my friend's ass. Really charming situation.

It seems to me that, when I've witnessed an intervention in that kind of public violence, the woman involved usually says everything is fine and she doesn't need help. And seems embarassed. And I wonder if they're ashamed to be in need of help, or ashamed that people know what's really going on in their lives.

I've never come across that sort of thing when I was alone or in a deserted street, nor have I heard anything from my neighbours. And while I like to think I'd be ready to act if I did, I know that I would worry about my personal safety, and that I wouldn't necessarily trust the police not to inflame the situation or blame the victim.

I once saw my cousin's husband throw her against a wall for coming home late. There were a few reasons not to do anything about it--he was bigger than us, his friends were there, I was drunk, there were drugs in the house so if the police came we'd all get in trouble, she didn't want to leave (in fact, she thought I was making a mountain out of a molehill). I called her mother the next day, who told me that it wasn't my business. I told my own mother, which started a gossip chain that eventually embarrassed my cousin into separating from him. He went to anger counseling, they got back together, and she doesn't talk to me anymore. I'm sure there were a thousand things I could have done differently, but I was 22 years old and scared. I hope he doesn't hurt her anymore, but it is ten years later, and I just don't know.

SexySmallTownFemme posted this link in a related Community posting:

http://neighboursfriendsandfamilies.ca/eng/helpingabusedwomenwaystosupporther.php

As a former shelter advocate, I tend to fall on the "call the cops" side. If you hear or see something that makes you believe someone is in danger, the police can respond quickly and (most of the time) effectively. I recall the story of one woman murdered by her boyfriend in the area where I lived at the time - on the night she was murdered, she was dragged screaming through the hallways of her apartment building and no one called the cops. It breaks my heart to think about it.

Also, calling the police is a way to intervene while protecting your own safety and anonymity, which is a legitimate concern.

A few posters have expressed concerns and frustrations about involving law enforcement, and I can totally understand. Sadly, even in the 21st century, laws regarding domestic violence and the training of officers on how to respond appropriately varies widely. When I was working as an advocate, I was lucky to be with an organization that had developed a strong relationship with local law enforcement to ensure appropriate responses and in a state with very solid DV laws (Minnesota). If you have concerns about calling the police, start asking questions of your local law enforcement agency and domestic violence organizations NOW. What are the laws in your state? How do police typically respond to a domestic call? Have they been trained in how to identify aggressive vs. defensive injuries? Do they have a relationship with their local shelter, and do they refer people to it? Getting the answers to these questions (and any more you can think of) help ensure the safety of victims when the police are called and beyond.

@ FrumiousB:

I'm not sure if you're responding to the right person. I never said a thing about why women are in abusive relationships, and I don't appreciate what I'm reading as your chastising tone.

That I don't know what the woman being beaten needs is EXACTLY my point. In most cases, at the time, it's impossible to ask the neighbor in question if she's in need of help. Even if you did knock on the door to ask, there's no way to tell if she genuinely doesn't want you to call the police or does and is afraid to say it in front of her attacker. Thus I would call the police because I don't believe I have the ability to judge whether or not she actually needs help.

yeah, frumiousb, i think you vastly misinterpreted roni's point... read it again, i think you'll agree.

and, roni, keep up the training (the language you used makes it sound like you've fallen off a bit)... stop dv today and start the rev tomorrow.

My sister went through a physically abusive relationship, and now it is happening to her daughter. My niece fled the home and is in a hotel waiting to be placed in a homeless shelter. I call or email her everyday or every other day (we live far away from each other). She's reporting that the romanctic movies she's watching in the hotel are making her feel weak. This reminded me of hearing the remake of "Listen to your heart" and thinking that there's probably a battered woman out there hearing this song somewhere and feeling like she should get back together with the slimeball. Romantic ideals don't apply after someone has abused you.

I hate seeing people I love become victims.

A few years ago I noticed a couple in a car in the car park next to my apartment complex. They were arguing fiercely, and a couple of times I saw him pull his fist back as if he was about to hit her. Without having seen him actually do it it was a bit hard to know what to do. There was no way I was going to watch a women get beaten up without doing something, but what to do when it wasn't quite there yet? Just ignore it, keep on walking and hope it didn't get any worse? I certainly couldn't intervene at that point. I eventually decided to stand nearby and make it clear that I was glancing over there every so often, on the basis that if she felt in danger she could ask for help and that a witness might discourage the guy from doing anything violent. They eventually drove elsewhere to sort their stuff out without some nosy guy watching them. I later discovered that they parked out on the street in front of the complex in a fairly public spot, so at least it wasn't a case of finding a secluded spot to beat her up.

A week ago, my partner and I took our kindergartner to the mall to do some school shopping. We sat in the parking lot while waiting for the kiddo to finish his after daycare snack. A man sitting in the car in front of ours started screaming abuse (fuck you, etc) at his female partner in front of her (their?) three kids--two girls and a boy, all grade school aged. We were shocked, but didn't really know what to do.

I was married to an abusive man for four years a couple of years ago. Seeing someone yelled at like that perked my PTSD right up. I was on the verge of breaking down, but I really, really wanted to talk to the woman.

We were parked at the back entrance to a particular store, so I thought I might have a chance. I found an old domestic violence advocate hotline business card in my purse and put it in my pocket. We went in and started shopping. I could not concentrate on finding clothing for my child, because I was trying to spot the woman. Eventually I saw her, but she was with her partner. I was too nervous to approach her. I wanted to just hand her the card and say, "I don't know if you need this, but I wanted to give it to you in case." I didn't, though.

We finished up shopping and went back to the car. By that time, her partner was back in their car, sitting in the passenger side, glowering, drinking a Budwieser tallboy. I asked my partner if I should go in and try to talk to the woman.

He is a pretty passive person, and his opinion was that we didn't know how she would react to me approaching her, etc. I also second guessed myself, wondering if I was overreacting due to my personal experiences.

We drove to a different store and I kept a look out for mall security (the police do not respond to the mall parking lot as it's private property) to let them know there was a man drinking beer in their parking lot. I didn't see any and didn't go out of my way to find one.

I continue to feel guilty for this, but I really wasn't sure what to do. I'm still not sure. He didn't hit her, certainly, but I wouldn't be surprised if he did at home. His yelling, pouting in the car and substance abuse were very familiar to me.

I thought briefly that it might be nice to make up some anti-domestic violence flyers to keep in the car for situations like this. I could put one on the offending person's car, as well as the cars around, so it would provide information in a "coincidental" way. I don't know if that would help at all but I'm grasping at straws.

Thanks for about this topic. I've really wanted to address this experience but my lurker-nature has made it hard to write my own post.

I was in a situation like that a couple of years ago, and posted about it on my blog over at AllGirlArmy.org:
http://www.allgirlarmy.org/blog/joey/2006/08/but_its_her_fault

I would also be hesitant to call the police. If the victim is an illegal immigrant, she could face deportation. The feeling that the police will protect you is a fairly priviledged stance that is simply not the reality for some people, especially those with any past criminal record and many minorities.

i've struggled with this too. thankfully, i'm usually in the company of badass women who have more training at handling these situations than i do. as a man, i'm always willing to back someone up, but i often worry that my involvement escalates the situation b/c it then becomes a challenge to the (assuming male) attacker's masculinity. i'm gonna be calling my local domestic violence org soon to get some more advice, but if others have thoughts, i'm all ears.

When I was a child, about 25 years ago, a third grade teacher had an adult come to our class to talk about abductions and how to prevent them. Nightmares for the rest of my life aside, the one piece of advice I always thought was useful from that talk -- when an adult grabs you, always yell "help, someone call the police, this is not my [mother/father/guardian/sibling, etc.]".

I think calling a hotline and asking for advice is probably the best idea. Does anyone have a national number handy that I can put in my cell phone?

I do very basic volunteer crisis intervention for a sexual assault/domestic abuse hotline and if I overheard an assault in my apartment complex... it's hard to know what to do.

In public and alone, I'd yell. Maybe not necessarily "I'm calling the cops" because I'm small and light myself. An increasingly loud "HEY!" can sometimes get the point across.

In my building, I would probably still call the police; if next time the woman decides to file a restraining order, a long list of incident reports is sometimes helpful. I'd definitely wait until the abuser wasn't home and call up my neighbor to leave my phone number "if [she] ever needs anything, day or night". Or drop by to say hello and leave the same message in person. Post fliers near the communal apartment mailboxes about RAINN, DV shelters. Anything that offers the victim an opportunity to exercise her own agency rather than try to force her to admit she's being abused.

But if I knew kids were living in the apartment, I'd have to call the police every time. Partner abuse doesn't always mean child abuse, but sadly I know that even witnessing the abuse of their children isn't always enough to break an abuser's grip on a victim. In a lot of states it is illegal for a woman to lose custody of her children solely because of the unsafe environment that goes hand in hand with an abusive relationship.

Long time reader, had to comment.

My aunt’s favorite story is about the time she and her then boyfriend (now my uncle) got beat up one night out in the parking lot of a club. My aunt- one of the only women I would never want to get in a physical fight with, because she would fight dirty (you think about these things in my family)- and my uncle saw a man beating up on his pregnant girlfriend. So my family being who they are, which is feminist-good ole’ southern boys (I LOVE IT!) decided to go and beat the shit out of this guy. You don’t beat up a woman and you don’t beat up a pregnant woman. Well they go over to stop the fight and start up another when the man starts beating up my uncle and the lady starts beating up my aunt (along with all of her friends that were there). As my aunt says, “We laughed our beaten asses all the way home.” You stop a fight if a man is hitting on a girl. If you get beaten the physical pain is only momentary, while the emotional anguish is more scarring.

Ps. I say feminist-southern boys because my dad has never pushed me towards any career. The only thing he has ever said about what I do with my future (professional wise) is that I “needed to get a job where you wouldn’t have to depend on a man to support you, cause women have it hard out there.” I fucking love my dad.

Long time reader, had to comment.

My aunt’s favorite story is about the time she and her then boyfriend (now my uncle) got beat up one night out in the parking lot of a club. My aunt- one of the only women I would never want to get in a physical fight with, because she would fight dirty (you think about these things in my family)- and my uncle saw a man beating up on his pregnant girlfriend. So my family being who they are, which is feminist-good ole’ southern boys (I LOVE IT!) decided to go and beat the shit out of this guy. You don’t beat up a woman and you don’t beat up a pregnant woman. Well they go over to stop the fight and start up another when the man starts beating up my uncle and the lady starts beating up my aunt (along with all of her friends that were there). As my aunt says, “We laughed our beaten asses all the way home.” You stop a fight if a man is hitting on a girl. If you get beaten the physical pain is only momentary, while the emotional anguish is more scarring.

Ps. I say feminist-southern boys because my dad has never pushed me towards any career. The only thing he has ever said about what I do with my future (professional wise) is that I “needed to get a job where you wouldn’t have to depend on a man to support you, cause women have it hard out there.” I fucking love my dad.

I have a similar story. While walking to work, I came across a man beating a woman on the street. She was down on her knees, begging, as he hit her around the face and shoulders. I pulled out my phone and yelled, "I'm calling 911!!" at them, at which point the woman got up and started threatening me. Then the man, who was very large, much bigger than I, also came after me, saying that he was going to hurt me (I can't really remember what he said.) The woman was spitting with anger at that point at my audacity for interrupting. So I just ran for it. I didn't want to get involved in their fucked-up relationship.I figured the woman would deny anything happened, and I would possibly get hurt. I wish there had been more I could do.

@ bruinmccon:

i think it's GREAT that you are looking for hotline numbers to be able to share.

There are three national hotlines that are really useful:

RAINN (Rape Abuse & Incest National Network):
1-800-656-HOPE (4673). RAINN also has an Online Hotline that you can get to by going to www.rainn.org

National Domestic Violence Hotline:
1-800-799-SAFE(7233) or 1-800-787-3224 (TTY)

National Child Abuse Hotline:
1-800-4-A-CHILD (422-4453)

I think jj had a good point about being able to call the police and think they'll protect you is a privilege.

However in the hypothetical situation of what would *I* do, I'm not sure if it matters. The chances of my neighbor being an illegal immigrant in danger of deportation are relatively small compared to being a woman in danger of being severely injured. Problems involving the hypothetical neighbors' race and personal history involve many factors. If I lack information, particularly if I don't know I lack it, it comes down to personal choice. I would rather try to do the right thing and risk doing the wrong thing, then do nothing. I recognize my privilege, particularly as the daughter of a cop, and try to share it by doing my best to make sure things are taken seriously and handled in a helpful manner.

Keep in mind as a comment thread we're all giving blanket answers to a highly variable situation. You can always come up with exceptions, but that doesn't necessarily invalidate the general answer.

CALL THE POLICE.

Sure, law enforcement doesn't always come through. But abusers regularly isolate their victims and I think it's important to establish some sort of outside contact. I'm thinking primarily of abuse in a home or apartment. While law enforcement is not perfect, there is a chance that at the very least the victim will be offered information on resources to help. I think all states in the US are required to press charges even if the victim opts not to. And even if she refuses to testify and charges are dropped, calls to the police establish a history of domestic violence reports. In the event that a woman wants to leave her abuser, there is a record of abuse if she wants to press new charges, get custody of her children, or get a restraining order. I've called the cops three separate times for different neighborhood (all three in different neighborhoods) domestic situations. I couldn't see any of the altercations, in each I could just hear a man screaming angrily at a woman. Maybe nothing serious was going on, but I always feel its better safe than sorry in these situations. I must have had great neighbors each place I lived because every time the dispatcher informed me that several people had already called. Each time the police showed up very quickly. The argument that a woman will get beat worse after the police come seems to be a poor one to me. An abuser's beatings will likely escalate over time whether the police come or not. They will find a reason. The abuse is always worse when the abuser is in danger of losing his control.

Whether or not to intervene personally is largely a matter of how safe you feel in the situation. In college I had a house in an area that was heavy traffic for people coming and going to the bars. I intervened on a drunken row when the guy physically restrained his girlfriend in order to yell at her (she had tried to walk away from him). I felt comfortable because they were just a drunk college kids and I was in an area with plenty of people walking by.

I think what would help us all would be hearing from people who are or were in abusive relationships about any time someone intervened while they were being threatened or abused, and whether they appreciated it or not. Because while it does seem like a typical initial response to intervention is anger and defensiveness on the part of the person being abused, we can't know whether it ended up helping them see things differently or not.

@Lisa,

I don't think we can so easily discount the risk of the abuser becoming more violent if someone calls the police. It's a very real reality we must recognize. Not only that, but because intimate partner violence is about power and control, victims often feel helpless and feel as if they've lost that power and control. In some cases, by calling the police, we can make survivor feel as if s/he has even LESS agency than before because we have made the decision of contacting law enforcement for her. Not to mention, there may be very good reason

And as Roni said, of course our own decisions about intervening should be based on the specific situation at hand. I don't believe we should never contact the police if we believe a person's safety is danger, rather I'm saying it's imperative we consider the consequences as they may affect the victim's safety and feelings of power and control.

I witnessed something like this just a couple of weeks ago! It was so scary!

There were some teenagers (maaybe early twenties) at the end of a BART platform kind of struggling, and at first I thought it was a flirtatious kind of wrestle, until I realized she was crying and shouting, "I don't want to go with you!"

I had to get closer to actually notice this, because the platform was so loud.

So I went up to them and asked her, "are you okay?" And she said, "No, I don't want to go with him." I said to him, "You need to let her go," and so of course he started yelling at me and calling me names and posturing like he might hit me, all the while holding onto her.

I called to another woman on the platform to go get the station agent, but then the trains pulled in on either side of the platform, and everyone on the platform decided to get on a train.

I followed the abductor onto the train - he was still holding onto the girl, who was still screaming and crying. He saw me follow and pulled her off the train, and which point she broke free and started running, but he caught up with he and grabbed her again as my train pulled away.

Can I just tell you how horrible I felt? I felt guilty for letting them out of my sight - because what if this was her last chance to be helped before he did something even more horrible to her? But on the other hand, what else was there to do in that moment? Follow them indefinitely? Get into a physical fight with this guy who was clearly physically stronger than I was?

I intercommed the driver and told her what I'd seen - I wish I'd had the presence of mind to get a good description of the two of them or even ask the girl her name. But as it was, I had been scared, and didn't have much to tell the driver. I couldn't even give much detail about what the girl had been wearing.

But the lucky thing is that the BART police were able to find them, and they arrested the abductor. He had been violating a restraining order.

I helped someone once. I was at a friend's house just chillin outside on the deck, where her ex came over. He was carrying their child, was really pissed, and soon started getting violent towards them.

At first I was just shocked into inaction, but then my partner yelled my name and then I immediately ran towards them and put him in a sleeper hold, while my friend gabbed the kid and ran inside. Another friend called the police. I let him go, and he chilled out. Later that day he thanked me for restraining him.

I'm a very skinny 5'9" guy, I was hoping he would try to fight with me, cause I love to fight. I actually fantasize about fighting people who are abusing women.

I agree its tricky calling the police...but all things considered if you think someone is really at risk...

I agree that the situation is never easy. My senior year of college my b/f lived in a house that was converted into four apartments. At the time it was us in one of the bottom apartments and a couple on the top. One night we heard screaming and yelling and thumps and what sounded like someone being dragged across the floor. We thought about calling the police but we were afraid of the guy as well. It would have obviously been us and the apartments weren't that secure. Fortunately the guy got picked up later on violating probation and we never saw him again.

I also worked in a domestic violence shelter and whenever an arrest for domestic violence occurred the local jail would call us and give us the pertinent information and the victim's number so we could call and attempt to make contact. I will say that in the year that I worked there very few of the women came into the shelter from the arrest numbers. Most of our intakes occurred after an even where the man had left after an incident or the woman had managed to escape.

I saw a parent abusing her two-year-old daughter in line at a store several years ago. The daughter was crying, and the mom was repeatedly calling her "stupid" and "ugly" and slapping her face. Everyone in line, including me, just kind of looked away and pretended to ignore it. It's not that I was scared of the woman physically retaliating against me; I'm ashamed to say that I was worried that I'd cause a scene or be considered rude/nosy if I got up in the business of a woman "disciplining" her child. In retrospect, I realize that was a dumb reason to stay out of it, but at the time the social pressure to ignore it was very strong. You could literally FEEL the people trying not to look. Monkey conformity is a powerful drug.

I've since read that calling out an abuser in public can make the situation worse when the abuser gets into the privacy of his or her home. However, I believe there are ways to de-fuse the immediate situation without further enraging the abuser. In the case of kids being abused, I've seen advice that you should acknowledge the abuser's stress and emphasize the humanity and goodness of the kid, e.g. "It sure looks like you're having a hard day. What a beautiful little girl! What's her name?"

There's only so much a stranger can do when it's a child that's being abused - you can't exactly hand her a card with a DV hotline on it. But you can deflect the abuse that's happening right then, and hope other strangers will do the same in future incidents.

By the way, I know this is a feminist site where we discuss feminist topics, but I honestly think it's sad that in 2008 we're still putting relationship violence in the "feminist" category rather than the "everybody" category. It drives me nuts to think that there are lots of people ranging from "domestic discipline" advocates to plain old traditional-gender-role conservatives who think it's fine for men to abuse women, physically and mentally, because that's just the way it should be. Sometimes women just need to be reminded of their place and it's the man's job to show he loves her by keeping her in line - vomit.

Once I was in a store and this man was absolutely screaming at a woman and a young child. It was terrible because no one (there weren't that many people in the store - me, an employee and maybe one other person) was doing or saying anything, everyone was just trying to disappear. I was scared, because the guy was huge and shouting horrible things, like, I'm gonna kill you and stuff like that. I kept trying to make Call-the-police-eye contact with the employee, but they were frozen. Finally, the guy stormed out. Then, I walked to the woman and put my hand on her arm, feeling like such an asshole for not doing anything. I asked her if she wanted us to call the police and she said yes. I said to the employee, Call the police, and then (this is outrageous) he was like, Uh, we can't call the police on someone else's behalf (What up, Blockbuster?!?) The whole thing was horrendous and I'm really ashamed that I didn't do more to help.

The agency I work for just did a 90 minute web conference about this topic today. It was called "Engaging Bystanders in Violence Against Women Prevention", and we put a lot of related materials on our website. A recording of the web conference will also be available on our website next week. Go to www.PreventConnect.org and look for the title of the conference towards the bottom of the page, click on that link, and you will see the materials. Everything on our website is free, by the way. We are grant funded.

When I was in highschool my step sister, who is two years older, was in a very abusive relationship. They would yell and scream at each other like crazy, both of them. I would approach them and tell them to stop, or tell him to leave, and initially things would calm down. But as their relationship progressed the abuse became physically violent, and they/he did not stop when I would ask them to. It's hard to tell in this specific situation, where exactly all the blame should lie. They would hit each other, I would SEE her hit him out of seemingly no where, and start some of their physical fights. I always sided with my step sister, one because she was my step sister, but two because he would/could hurt her a lot more than she could hurt him. And he did. Broken wrist and two broken collar bones, he wrecked her car by smashing all the windows, put holes in our walls, gave her black eyes. He was banned from our house by my parents, but she would invite him over when they were at work. The point is that I did intervene, for years, every time, but after a while I would let more slide. Like if they were screaming at each other I wouldnt bother because at least they weren't hitting eachother, and they wouldn't do anything if I bothered them anyways. I knew if I called the police they would BOTH kill me. One day I had a friend over who had never been to my house, and he heard their screaming fight and he said we have to go help her. And I said "don't bother." His reaction, facial expression, made me feel so ashamed, but after years and years, and when the woman won't end the relationship, what can you do? They arent technically dating anymore, but as recently as six months ago he gave her a black eye, and as recently as three months ago she "ran away" briefly with him.

I've been in a few situations where I've witnessed semi-violent behavior (just yelling, no actual abuse) from parents or partners, and I've always wondered if there's a right time to intervene... especially when I see children getting screamed at and belittled by their parents. I've also seen parents hit their children, but then again, that's another one of those "gray" areas where one person will say hitting children is an okay disciplinary measure, while others won't.

So now I try to remember something I heard someone else say on another blog -- and I used to have a t-shirt that said it too -- "Silence is Complicity."

When you don't say or do anything when someone is violently attacking (physical or not) another person, you're complicit in their crime. You're silently acknowledging that their behavior is okay. I know that we all want to do the best thing for the victim and cause her (or him) less harm, but the more people that speak up and say "That's not right," the more she will get that message and the more SOCIETY will get that message and stop allowing this violent behavior to continue.

We have been complicit in domestic violence for YEARS by saying it's "a personal matter within their relationship."

Same thing goes for if you hear men making sexist jokes or belittling their girlfriends or when you hear people being racist, ableist, or any other kind of negative behavior toward other people. Being silent is another way of telling the offender that their behavior is acceptable. And that's what we really need to fight. Our own silence.

What I've heard - I don't know if it's right - is that one should always speak to the victim instead of the attacker. It helps avoid situations like the ones described where the victim starts attacking the "helper," and is less confrontational.

One time Mr. Zoe and I were riding our bikes home from dinner, when we passed a woman sitting on the curb outside a depot where trucks load from train. Not, in and of itself unusual, mind- but she was crying and was wearing no shoes. Turned out her boyfriend had literally shoved her out of a moving car and left her stranded, no purse, no shoes, nothing. We were too far from our house to take her there so I sat with her while she called her uncle to come get her and Mr. Zoe stood around looking intimidating.

The other time was kind of similar to the orginal post. Again, it was me and Mr. Zoe. I'm 5'2" and weigh about 100lbs. He's a foot taller, 100lbs heavier, construction worker with shaved head. We just looked at each other and went over to the couple. I asked the woman if she was OK, if I could help. She mumbled affirmative. Then he started trying to grab her. I told him to stop or I would call the police. He looked at me like he might punch me, then at Mr. Zoe, and said "Yeah, whatever, bitch" to me, and to her "Fuck you, c*nt." Mr. Zoe just stood and glowered the whole time. However I don't think I would have been brave enough to approach them if he hadn't been there. Once she calmed down she said she wanted to go to the police and file a report so we went with her to do that as well.

Moody, Mr. Zoe has that same fantasy! He really wanted to pummel his best friend's abusive boyfriend but settled for moving her things out of the dude's apartment.

I once saw an experiment on TV where a woman got two actor friends to portray a couple fighting in the middle of a park. She secretly videotaped passersbyas they reacted in various ways - from stopping and staring to actually stepping in. Afterwards, she explained to them that it was all staged and asked them questions about what they did and why. Interestingly, the ones who stepped in and got involved were almost always women.
Does anyone else know what I'm talking about? If so, do you have a link?

I'm not sure if I would be brave enough to intervene if I was alone. I would probably skip straight to calling the police and trying to watch from a distance.

This is one reason I try to carry my cellphone everywhere. I figure if I see anything, I can punch 911 into the phone and hold my thumb over the Call button while I ascertain the situation.

By the way, thanks for that link, FrumiousB.

Also, I forgot to add in my original post -- Chicago has a hotline number where you can report all kinds of things, from cabbie complaints to situations you think might be dangerous but aren't sure and don't want to waste the police's time if you're wrong.

That number is 311. Other cities may have similar hotlines but I'm not sure. Your city website should have a local non-emergency number listed in its phone database, so it's worth memorizing and adding to your phone for these kinds of situations.

Bandersnatch, perhaps the show was on ABC primetime and called "What Would You Do?" It is show where an event is staged and people's reactions are filmed. I'm not sure if this is what you are talking about or not because I don't recall a woman setting it up or asking questions (I actually thought it was a man). If this isn't the show you are thinking of then it is interesting to note that I believe I remember more women intervening then too. On a personal note I used to be in a very unhealthy relationship that was occasionally physically and emotionally abusive. One day my partner was verbally being a jerk to me while we were out to eat and our waitress told him off. I was surprised because I was so used to him acting that way and worse that I didn't even recognize just how bad his treatment of me had become. The waitress stepping in just for a moment helped me see that his behavior really was unacceptable enough to draw attention from other people. Sometimes when you are in a relationship like that you cease to see just how bad things really are and forget what healthy behavior looks like. I didn't leave him anytime soon after that unfortunately but it was something that stuck in my head. That said, there was also another time when a friend's bf intervened when my drunk partner had me by the throat. My partner turned on him and physically assaulted him. Both cases helped me to see that what was going on was not ok and that people cared but as the second incident proves intervening can be dangerous. Now, if anyone had ever called the police I would have been devastated and felt ashamed (even though I realize he should have been the ashamed one) and I don't think it would have helped me to leave him. I am not sure if it would have scared him into not being abusive or not. (I kind of doubt it) Of course, if he was more physically abusive than he was and actually beat me to the point where I was sustaining numerous and serious injuries and feared for my life then I would have probably welcomed a call to the police to rescue me and believe I would have left him. So, it is a tough call and I really feel it needs to be made on an individual basis.

I have a story. Every night my partner and I take our dogs to the local dog park. We aren't very well off and therefore don't live in the best part of the city. One of the regulars there one night called out "does anyone have a cellphone?" with a frantic voice. I offered mine as I walked toward him and asked what was up.

He pointed to a car diagonal from where we were. Standing next to the car was a huge guy hitting a sobbing woman while a small girl sat in the dirt nearby. I am a girl, as is my partner. The man was older and certainly couldn't take the abuser on. I called the cops.

This part of the neighborhood, cops drive by almost every 15 minutes. I reported the incident, explained that the beating was taking place right then. The woman assured me the cops would be there as soon as possible. A few minutes of tense waiting later and the cops called me back, saying there was something wrong with the location I had given them. It was their mistake, I corrected them.

The old guy walked to the car as we waited, trying to get close enough to see the license plate number but not too close to get noticed by the angry guy.

30 minutes later I called dispatch again. I said the woman was STILL getting beaten. The dispatch officer asked "Is there blood"? I said I didn't know and she responded with "Well, without blood I cannot upgrade the priority of the call" and hung up on me!

What the hell is higher priority than a woman getting BEATEN while a child watches? The cops showed up 45 minutes later. Don't worry, they got the guy. He was STILL beating her.

She left in an ambulance. I hope she left him.

I have a story. Last spring, I was in my dorm at school, getting ready to go out. I heard what sounded like people steeping on branches outside my dorm, which was common enough, so I continued doing what I was doing. I kept hearing these noises and low voices, and then I heard a woman's voice say, "Please don't rape me."

For about a minute I hesitated. Then I yelled, "Hey!" quite loudly out the window, to which a man's voice responded, "I'm just trying to walk her home." She kept pleading with the guy, so I decided I would go downstairs and scare the guy off. I didn't even think that this guy was probably bigger than me, or maybe even had a weapon; I just could not live with myself if I let that situation continue. So I went downstairs, and by the time I got there the guy had run off. She was on the ground, knees scraped, skirt pushed up and tube top pulled down. I asked if she wanted me to call the cops and she said yes.

I was dumbfounded by what happened next. The cops, who were actually university police, arrived very quickly. (It was the weekend of one of our school's big festivals, so I would guess that they had quite a few people on duty.) The woman was drunk, and apparently underage, so when the cops tried to ask what happened and who she was with, she wouldn't respond and tried to go inside the building. One of the officers tried to get her to calm down and talk to them, she pushed him away. They put her in the back of the car as the other officer told me that they had had several incidents with her before due to underage consumption. She called me a bitch and said I made the whole thing up.

I have no idea what happened to her. I wasn't in town the next day, but my neighbor told me she had come by to apologize and thank me for intervening. I don't know if I did the right thing. I just know that if I tried to ignore her pleading I would never forgive myself. If I were in the same position I would hope someone would do the same for me.

In my deepest feelings, we are all one. That is my family member in need of help. I help instinctively and with thought. I rely on self defense techniques I've learned to determine which way to get involved. Whether it is a yell, "NO!" or "STOP NOW"
"CALL 911"
or physically stepping in, reaching in and getting someone out, etc.
To the commentors who suggest calling the police:
In many neighborhoods, the police wont answer the call!
911 is busy!
We have to help ourselves and each other. I will repeat this- Please get a variety of self defense training.

Years ago I argued that W.S. Burroughs was wrong about his belief that American citizens should each "Mind your own business..."
If we did that, we still would not have the words, intervention and support for survivors of all sorts of atrocities.

Mind your own business is a predator's statement.

Get involved. Start with self defense training.

I was thinking about this last night and I just realised I had ANOTHER story that I completely forgot about (I have no idea how).

When I was about ten, I was walking home from a friends house and passed the house of a family who were known to be quite dodgy. As I was passing the mother in the house opened the door and called me over. I always thought she was a bit crazy or whatever so I only walked about halfway into the garden and she asked me to come in to the house because....her husband was trying to kill her. I have no idea, what on earth, she thought that a ten-year-old me was going to do in that scenario (I also had no idea where her husband was at that particular point). Anyway, I said no but I'd go home and call the police. I ran home terrified and told my Mum who called the police who said (and I quote) "We'll send someone up later - we've been up already today."

Ps. Jecca - I think you were totally right to intervene.

I am not sure if anyone has said this yet, but if it is a domestic violence situation and the police are called, from what I've seen, the victim may not get deported, but the person performing the abuse will most likely. I have seen many cases in which immigrants breathe a sigh of relief because their spouse/partner has been deported because they/someone have called the police. It doesn't solve all problems, clearly, but it is something to get the abuser away for awhile (they can come back if they so choose). Also, "illegal" immigrants who are being abused are allowed to file for legal status in some situations, which is made easier by a police report. I guess I'm trying to say call the police because a paper trail documenting abuse seems to almost always help.

This is an extremely useful thread. I've had this same discussion with friends, family members, and partners, and it's always bothered me that no one (myself included) really *knows* how to respond to witnessing abuse.

Just a thought, but I think it would be helpful to put together a simple pamphlet containing something along the lines of:

1) Situations that merit a response (e.g. visible physical/verbal abuse, loud domestic disputes in neighboring homes/apartments),
2) How/when to respond to a given situation (e.g. when to call the police, when personal intervention is safe/useful, and perhaps some general rule, like...'respond as if the person being abused is a friend or family member of yours')
3) Why to respond (facts on domestic abuse, etc)
4) Important phone numbers/organizations to contact.

Canvassing a community with such a pamphlet (via mass mailing, probably) could do some good on two fronts. First, it would hopefully give people some confidence/motivation to respond to such situations. Second (and admittedly much less likely), it might make abusers think twice...kind of like the effect of 'neighborhood watch' signs.

Obviously it would take some money, resources, and expertise to complete a project like this, but if done in conjunction with local women's organizations and law enforcement, it could be done. I think I'm going to look into doing this in my community, but I thought I'd float the idea here, first. Thoughts?

I think about this all of the time, especially at the grocery store I frequent. I live pretty close to Camden, NJ (you know, the most dangerous city in the US) and witness a lot of foul language and head slapping directed towards kids. I don't know quite what to do, it's obviously a lack of education on the parents part, and frankly, when you live in Camden it's not like you have a lot of shining examples of conscious parenting (don't flame me, this is the truth as I see it, I've worked with these families when I did social work and welfare services). I also see this at a family fun park nearby where my boyfriend and I bring his children. We noticed these poor kids were being slapped in the head for really nothing. We do not hit in our house, but realize other parents do..but hitting in the head? If you feel you need to parent "that way", isn't a smack on the butt more than enough? The shame of it is, these little kids for the most part were not misbehaving, certaintly NOTHING IMO warrants a slap in head! It is sad to know these kids will probably grow up to be just like their parents.

So, what to do? Esp. when a middle class white girl calls these parents out? It all feels so futile.

I'm a student at Warren Wilson College in Asheville, North Carolina and I work for the sexual assault prevention and awareness crew on campus. We've put together a couple of zines and we've decided that our next topic should be bystander intervention. If anyone has any resources or ideas we'd really really appreciate it. Just reply to this post and we can work something out. Thanks!

Sounds like she swung first. Why no concern for the fact that she escalated the confrontation to assault? Regardless of size differences is it really ok for a woman to initiate violence? Sounds like he didn't start the arm grabing until she swung at him?

It is a tough question to answer exactly when to get involved since all of us have different norms and boundaries. What might seem acceptable to one might be completely unacceptable to others. I usually follow my instinct and heart because I am the one getting involved. So if I feel that a situation needs intervention, I do so regardless of what the criticism by others might be.

It is a tough question to answer exactly when to get involved since all of us have different norms and boundaries. What might seem acceptable to one might be completely unacceptable to others. I usually follow my instinct and heart because I am the one getting involved. So if I feel that a situation needs intervention, I do so regardless of what the criticism by others might be.

It is a tough question to answer exactly when to get involved since all of us have different norms and boundaries. What might seem acceptable to one might be completely unacceptable to others. I usually follow my instinct and heart because I am the one getting involved. So if I feel that a situation needs intervention, I do so regardless of what the criticism by others might be.

Last year I was on the subway platform (in Berlin) with my then-boyfriend. A younger woman and man were arguing - the man threw money at her and she threw in onto the ground, crying, and then they started grabbing each other and pushing... when he slapped her in the face, I yelled "HEY!!!" and ran over. Simultaneously, another man ran over and said to the hitter, "COOL IT!", and removed him PHYSICALLY from the woman when he started to choke her.

The helping man was a tourist, he didn't speak any german. I was too upset and shaken to speak anything but english (I am not german). My german-speaking THEN-boyfriend watched and DID NOTHING. Nice that it took a couple of "foreigners" to help someone in trouble...

In recent years, the involvement of the military in securing peace in (post-)conflict situations has come under scrutiny by feminists, anti-racist scholars, and others. Such work rarely, however, places psychological interventions under similar scrutiny. This paper investigates 'psy' interventions in post-conflict situations, including all of those interventions directed at the psyches of former combatants, 'child soldiers,' and 'victims' of conflict. The diagnosis of post-traumatic stress disorder has become increasingly prevalent, particularly among those most easily understood to be victims of war: 'women and children.' Preventive logic underpins 'psy' interventions, as they are meant to disrupt a 'cycle of violence.' Thus, the cause of violence is located within individual psyches in ways that often pathologize entire populations. The paper draws out several implications of this trend towards 'psy' interventions. These include the ways in which it is involved in the construction of the West as the locus of (masculine) rationality; it is one more extension of the uses of psychology and psychiatry in securing liberal subjects; it reproduces the authority of the 'psy' disciplines; and also raises questions about actions taken in the name of peace.
-------------
------------
mukesh11
Drug Intervention Michigan - Drug Intervention Michigan

Hi,

A very smart and diplomatic answer. It’s really appreciable and generous.

Miller

Drug Intervention Minnesota