un fucking believable...

that is all i can muster...

i have to go purge my itunes now...

I'm a bit ambivalent about this.

Wait, no. I'm not. The idea that one could discriminate against ticket fee-paying fans because of their weight is disgusting.

The part I'm a bit ambivalent about is that stages sometimes have weight restrictions. If the restrictions were for that reason, it's understandable, though not well thought out. The most logical course of action would not be to ban fans over a certain weight from going on stage, but to choose the fans that come on stage ahead of time, and make sure their collective weight doesn't exceed the stage's limits. No discrimination based on individuals' size, and first come, first serve.

ummm, Wyclef you kidding me? No more respect for this guy.

I think it's on the Ecleftic where Wyclef has an interlude* that goes something like:

Hey there, boy and girls, imagine if you go over to some random woman's house, at her invitation, and suddenly she cries "Rape! Rape! Rape!"

And you like totally didn't do anything wrong. What the fuck's matter with these bitches anyway?

OK, the first part is paraphrased, the second is the obvious message, but it's still typical rape apology.

And, frankly, each of his albums has a couple of good songs, such as "Guantanamera" on the Carnival, but most are mediocre at best.

*I'm so glad that most musicians seem to be giving up that "interlude" nonsense.

Could TMZ please make up their mind? They shame Jennifer Love Hewitt with "We know what you ate this summer, Love -- everything!" (http://www.tmz.com/2007/11/28/its-jennifer-love-hewitt/)

I can't see the video at work, so maybe they are saying that good ol' Wyclef is right to declare no fat chicks, but it seems from the text they are calling him out on it.

Does TMZ want to shame women that are as "fat" or "fatter" than Jennifer Love Hewitt or not? I'm so confused.

it's probably okay for people to decide for themselves who they see as attractive.

It's also probably harmful to promote unrealistic standards of beauty.

Can one be a feminist and still be attracted to slender people? I think so.

Personally, I would feel uncomfortable talking about my personal life on stage like that, but I think that Wyclef should be able to express himself however he wants.

This article, however, seems awfully scant details, however. So I'd like to read more about Wyclef the artist and the event in question before I pick an approach.

Feministing and TMZ coming together to expose sexism.

This sucks because I like Wyclef's music. I saw him in concert a couple of years ago, and he didn't invite anyone on the stage or disrespect women in any way. But I don't think I'm going to see him in concert again unless he apologizes or something.

Mirielle and Rebecca C. both have good points. Maybe TMZ wants to be the sole perpetuator of beauty standards in the entertainment world. And the concert organizers should definitely arrange which audience members go on stage beforehand.

I'm not jumping with glee at this, but let's face it there are waaaay worse offenses against women in the hip-hop industry. Listen to the lyrics of pretty much any club banger, for example. I'm not getting rid of my Wyclef albums because he does spend a fair amount of time and lyrical energy promoting positive social change.

Can one be a feminist and still be attracted to slender people? I think so.

Of course you can, however, I don't think this has anything to do with attraction. This isn't about Wyclef's personal preference for thinner girls though (because I have no idea of his personal taste in women); this is about someone inviting people to be showcased, and then telling some people, basically, that no one wanted to look at them.

Imagine he had specified that he didn't want any Asian women, for example, to come up on the stage instead of any fat women. I think it's easy to write this kind of thing off as an issue of personal taste when it comes to body shape/size, but really it is no different then negatively singling out any other group. What he said made fat women into the "other," and he deemed them unworthy for public view. And no one is unworthy of public view.

Can one be a feminist and still be attracted to slender people? I think so.

Of course you can, however, I don't think this has anything to do with attraction. This isn't about Wyclef's personal preference for thinner girls though (because I have no idea of his personal taste in women); this is about someone inviting people to be showcased, and then telling some people, basically, that no one wanted to look at them.

Imagine he had specified that he didn't want any Asian women, for example, to come up on the stage instead of any fat women. I think it's easy to write this kind of thing off as an issue of personal taste when it comes to body shape/size, but really it is no different then negatively singling out any other group. What he said made fat women into the "other," and he deemed them unworthy for public view. And no one is unworthy of public view.

Sorry for the double post!

this is made even worse by the fact that wyclef hasn't been relevant since the fugees. now he's a fucking idiot too? perfect.

"What he said made fat women into the "other," and he deemed them unworthy for public view. And no one is unworthy of public view."

Oh if only that were true for everyone. We may believe that, but there sure are a lot of folks who don't. Just listen to the people laugh after he said that...I can guarantee you that at least one woman felt the need to hide.

Ehhh - I am not buying the stage limit theory.

As for TMZ, I will not make myself go crazy and pretend they have any logic when deciding who to give props to and who to bring down.

Are you guys serious making apologies for this guy? Some of these comments have really surprised me!! If any artist had called up a group of women and sent all the black women off the stage or all the Asian women off the stage, we would be incensed, but because he picked on women who were 200+ pounds it’s just “personal preference?� REALLY?

"Well maybe he was worried about the weight limit of the stage"

--- ummm, then invite 15-20 girls up instead of 30, but don't say, "Don't come up here if you're over 200 pounds" (anyone else notice the cruel, mocking way in which he said it. As if fat woman were doing some disservice to him and his show by simply existing on the stage.)

Also "Can one be a feminist and still be attracted to slender people?"
-- Yes, but this wasn't Wyclef looking for a date. This was a guy, as one commenter so aptly put it-- telling a group of WOMEN that you're only worthy of "shaking your ass" for the crowd if said ass fits the a certain standard. Naturally as a man, he gets to judge and enforce these standards?

GROSS!

When I watched the video. I thought I saw one larger woman step back off the stage after the announcement. How horrifying.

This is just the worst type of misogyny: "Come up on stage and shake that ass for me-- eww, your fat ass, go sit back down."

Fuck you Wyclef.

Imagine he had specified that he didn't want any Asian women, for example, to come up on the stage instead of any fat women.

Not the same. One can be fat, cut back on food, and become thin. One CAN'T be Asian, change her diet, and become Anglo. Fat can change, ethnicity can't.

Also, have you ever noticed the symbol for feministing.com. Look at the top of the page. It's a silhouette of a Barbie doll THIN woman with great hair.

I don't think it really matter whether or not a fat woman can change her size; Wyclef has no right to discriminate against those women and he's simply promoting weightism as well as objectifying women.

What bothered me most about the video was first of all, that he wanted the girls in stage to "shake their asses" for the viewing pleasure of males in attendance and second of all, that the women seemed to have no problems with his comments. Women were still getting on stage after he imposed the weight limit. It seems sad and kind of scary that those women seem so completely oblivious to Wyclef's asinine comments.

It's probably okay to not be attracted to given racial qualities.

If Wyclef had said "black girls should come on the stage" I don't think people would be as upset.

This is the flip-side of the issue of saying "girls but no asians/chicanas/whatever"

The way in which we are attracted to people is very definitely a social construction, and often times that construction can be racist/sexist/whatever, but it doesn't make peoples' preferences any less valid. Even if we wanted to draw a line about what things it is "okay" to be attracted to, there's no easy answer. Also, the group in control of drawing those lines gains a lot of power that they probably shouldn't have.

It's probably okay to enjoy watching people shake their asses. Some people enjoy shaking their asses. Wyclef didn't force anyone to do anything.

sex-negative feminism is kind of upsetting to me. If someone could elaborate a little more on why we shouldn't be permissive of ass-shaking, I would like to read it.

personally, I don't like Wyclef's rapping that much, and many of his lyrics seem very much within essentialist and sexist modes. That doesn't mean he can't be attracted to whoever he wants.

It's probably okay to not be attracted to given racial qualities.

If Wyclef had said "black girls should come on the stage" I don't think people would be as upset.

This is the flip-side of the issue of saying "girls but no asians/chicanas/whatever"

The way in which we are attracted to people is very definitely a social construction, and often times that construction can be racist/sexist/whatever, but it doesn't make peoples' preferences any less valid. Even if we wanted to draw a line about what things it is "okay" to be attracted to, there's no easy answer. Also, the group in control of drawing those lines gains a lot of power that they probably shouldn't have.

It's probably okay to enjoy watching people shake their asses. Some people enjoy shaking their asses. Wyclef didn't force anyone to do anything.

sex-negative feminism is kind of upsetting to me. If someone could elaborate a little more on why we shouldn't be permissive of ass-shaking, I would like to read it.

personally, I don't like Wyclef's rapping that much, and many of his lyrics seem very much within essentialist and sexist modes. That doesn't mean he can't be attracted to whoever he wants.

It's probably okay to not be attracted to given racial qualities.

If Wyclef had said "black girls should come on the stage" I don't think people would be as upset.

This is the flip-side of the issue of saying "girls but no asians/chicanas/whatever"

The way in which we are attracted to people is very definitely a social construction, and often times that construction can be racist/sexist/whatever, but it doesn't make peoples' preferences any less valid. Even if we wanted to draw a line about what things it is "okay" to be attracted to, there's no easy answer. Also, the group in control of drawing those lines gains a lot of power that they probably shouldn't have.

It's probably okay to enjoy watching people shake their asses. Some people enjoy shaking their asses. Wyclef didn't force anyone to do anything.

sex-negative feminism is kind of upsetting to me. If someone could elaborate a little more on why we shouldn't be permissive of ass-shaking, I would like to read it.

personally, I don't like Wyclef's rapping that much, and many of his lyrics seem very much within essentialist and sexist modes. That doesn't mean he can't be attracted to whoever he wants.

wordpress is bullshit.

Also, have you ever noticed the symbol for feministing.com. Look at the top of the page. It's a silhouette of a Barbie doll THIN woman with great hair.
It's a parody of the "sexy" and quite widespread mudflap girl. Notice the hand that she's holding up. It's not perpetuating the "only thin is sexy" myth, it's re-appropriating a well-known (and quite sexist) American symbol (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mudflap_girl).

Also:
One can be fat, cut back on food, and become thin. One CAN'T be Asian, change her diet, and become Anglo. Fat can change, ethnicity can't.

For women with naturally bigger builds, cutting back on food only goes so far. You can reduce your body fat and help yourself become healthier via exercise and healthy diet, but you cannot get rid of wide hipbones and the like without surgery.

Additionally, an Asian woman can make herself look more Anglo -- witness the travesty that is the Indian skin-whitening industry, the Oriental eyelid surgery industry, the new Chinese propensity for breaking and elongating their legs, ad nauseum.

A day late, but I need to add to the comments. What does an asian woman changing her skin color have to do with a person over 200 lbs loosing weight? Sorry 200 pound gyrl, you're not as discriminated against because you can change and others cannot. That's how it sounds to me anyway. Discrimination is discrimination and as we break through societal racism, sexism, etc. I am always surprised how we resist seeing the chore acts of discrimination.

And yeah, we mispeak, we don't think sometimes, but until we start looking at how easy we discriminate, we're just going to continue to switch are targets.

There were over a ton in weight on that stage (that's a 1,000 punds). Count the people, calculate your guestimate weight for each woman size and you get over a ton. So, why the hell is the 200 lb gyrl excluded? She's not gonna be the one to break the floor, it would be the sum of the total, not just "her." Get it. But she's being blamed by Wycleff, whether or not it was his intention.

That's the discrimination here folks. And yeah, 200 lb gyrl can change. She can loose weight and by golly she can obtain the body that society deems as most fuckable...but that's not the point here. The point is, if the stage breaks its Ms. 200 lbs fault. Not the huge mass of people dancing. Not the fact the Wycleff let them all on. Its that one or two gyrls (over 200) who broke the bank and it would be there fault. That's what I got.

Here's some empowerment in this whole deal. Did anyone else notice some of the gyrls who were over 200 lbs dancing on stage anyway? I just want to say holla! Way to stay on stage and dance ladies.

And look, nothing broke and no one had to change their skin tones.

~GoGo

One can be fat, cut back on food, and become thin. One CAN'T be Asian, change her diet, and become Anglo. Fat can change, ethnicity can't.

Even if it were true that dieting can cause people to achieve permenant weight loss (and there are many studies that say it can't...at least 95% of people who lose weight manage to gain it all back plus more...see here: http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/05/08/healthscience/snfat.php?page=1 for some evidence), no one in this society is under any obligation to look or be a certain way in order to demand respect and to be treated like everyone else.

What really made me sad about that clip was that a couple of not-super-thin women can be seen climbing up there before he makes that remark! So, wtf -- imagine how it felt to be them. Asshole.

"Not the same. One can be fat, cut back on food, and become thin. One CAN'T be Asian, change her diet, and become Anglo. Fat can change, ethnicity can't."

Is this your excuse for bigotry? That, in your uninformed, ignorant opinion, fat people can just snap their fingers and become socially acceptable and thin, that makes it okay to discriminate against them?

Go read Shapely Prose to see just how far off the mark you are with this overly simplistic takedown.

"Also, have you ever noticed the symbol for feministing.com. Look at the top of the page. It's a silhouette of a Barbie doll THIN woman with great hair."

Way to totally miss the point.

I know I am also chiming in a little late, but I don't understand how anyone can assert that this is about who Wyclef is attracted to. The issue here is that he publicly humiliated and demeaned women over 200 pounds. And yes, I am pretty sure I saw a heavier woman getting off the stage after he said that - which must have been humiliating for her. He sent a message that heavier women cannot be sexy and do not have value, in addition to sending the message that women's role is to shake their asses for his and other men's viewing pleasure (an old message, but offensive nonetheless).
I am really disappointed because I saw a Wyclef concert at my old university about a year ago. I hadn't really listened to his music much before that, but I was converted afterwards because he put on a great show. At that concert, he invited lots of people up on stage, men and women, and didn't impose any bullshit weight limits. He seemed really cool but after those comments I have definitely changed my mind.

"One can be fat, cut back on food, and become thin."

Actually, no. Not always. There are plenty of people out there who exercise, eat properly, and are still considerably heavier than average. That kind of statement simply perpetuates the myth that overweight people are overweight because they are lazy, have no self-control, etc.

There is NEVER an acceptable time or "reason" to discriminate against fat people. Wyclef is a sizeist ass, plain and simple. Fortunately, the only music I have of his is an illegally downloaded copy of "Killing Me Softly." Since he received no money for it (thank you, Lime Wire!) I don't feel bad about keeping it.

By thy by, having 200 lbs as any kind of cutoff is laughable and arbitrary. It has been imposed by our society as a number that is disgusting and unacceptable, but more people than you think actually weigh 200 lbs, give or take. I mean, depending on how they carry their weight, someone weighing 200 pounds could fit into clothing as small as a size 12, which I will remind you is the national average. Somehow, though, we are taught to think 200=gargantuan. It's both laughable and sick.

Mmmm...typos and multiple use of the same adjective in one paragraph...I am on fire.

First off 200 pounds for a woman is gargantuan. Hell, 200 pounds for a man under 6'5 and not on a competitive sports team is ridiculous and gargantuan. IT IS UNHEALTHY. How many 200 pound women do you know who can run a 12 minute mile (2 x slower than what is expected from a 6th grader)? Walk up a flight of stairs without wheezing? Don't end up with diabetes or a host of other sicknesses? Look, I'm all for not listening to what the media (white media not wyclef...afterall take a look at the white stick figure on your Body Politic '08 image) says you should look like, yada yada, but you can take that crap too far. I am black and know all too well that listening to that "big boned" "naturally big" "I'm not fat, its my body type" crap is contributing to the exploding fat related disease and malaise in our community. Period. That dress-size body image crap came from you and your people. It's not wyclef or black men or any swarthy skinned men getting Samoan girls to mutilate themselves-its your father...oops the patriarchy. Why don't you talk about that or break up your guns and roses cds and the rest of the misogynistic white music that gets a pass cause discussing it would get your white princess card revoked by your father.

I really don't know why I need to defend myself, but what the hell, I'll bite. I can run a 12-minute mile. I regularly walk up to my 4th floor apartment and don't wheeze. In fact, if you are ever in New York, take the F train to York St, walk up the stair-stair-ramp-stair-stair combo and then talk to me, because I do it every day with no problem. I take classes 4 days a week a school that is about a mile from my apartment. And I walk both ways. Some days I do it multiple times. A few months ago I went for a physical and every single test they did came back normal. I'm not diabetic. I'm not even pre-diabetic. My blood pressure is at the lower end of the normal range (which is actually remarkable considering everyone on my mom's side of the family has sky-high blood pressure). Guess what? I weigh well over 200 pounds.

In high school I was on the swim team. And you know what? At 18, the age when everyone is alleged to be at their thinnest, I weighed over 200 pounds. With what amounted to about 18 hours a week in the pool. And good eating habits because if you eat crap and work out like that you don't make it. I was probably about 210-215, I wore a size 16, maybe 14 in some stuff. So really, tell me how you can possibly call genetics and body frame "crap" when I am sitting right here. I haven't seen a weight with a 1 in front since middle school, and I am as in shape and healthy as anyone. Hell, I bet I could take on a lot of people who are naturally thin but don't care for themselves.

Since saying "fuck you" wouldn't help my point, I'll restrain myself. Even though I'm fat, I can exercise restraint. Fancy that.

Bigotry is bigotry - PERIOD. It doesn't matter if your looks are by "choice" or not.

I weight 300+ pounds. I regularly climb the stairs to class while all the skinny girls take the elevator. And I don't have a medical problem to speak of.

Oh, but convenient stereotypes are SO much easier to throw at fat people though!

Ah, and one more line from a favorite parody blog:

"Narrowly acceptable diversity: it’s the spice of life."