The is great article in the UK press about how men can't raise kids.

This guy isn't just an anti-feminist... he's simply unhinged. His sense of logic has completely failed.

Let me quote Diane from an early episode of Cheers:

"Speaking for educated women around the world, let me just say whew."

What the HELL?! Okay, besides the anti-feminism, since when do men clean up the mess? Men MAKE the mess (Bush admin going into Afghanistan and Iraq, prime examples) and it is the women on the ground who suffer the most and tend to be doing the day-to-day work in the face of danger (FROM THE MEN) and are most effective at rebuilding projects (after the men destroy things).

ALSO: "takes issue with women wearing skirts"

What??? Wouldn't it be less incongruous to take issue with women wearing PANTS? I thought antifeminists were more intimidated by women taken out of the traditional role, and consequently, out of the traditional dress. But then, I've never claimed, I don't think, to actually have any clue where antifeminists are coming from...

"even children are suffering the effects of the push for equal opportunities, with family break-up denying many their fathers’ love."

well maybe the dads just suck at being fathers, hence, the denial of "many of their fathers' love"--let's try not to blame everything on the stronger ones in the family--WOMEN--instead of feeling sorry for the guys that can't handle a person with their own mind.

i can't believe this guy was a teacher. i can't even fathom the horrid ideas he must've been planting in his students' brains.

oh, and liza ~ he does want the ladies in skirts. at the bottom of the article is this quote:
September 2004

Retired vicar Kenneth Dobson, of Swansea, writes in ManKind’s journal that women should wear skirts. “Drab, dreary and often scruffy, the female has been driven into that most ungainly and often hideous garment – the trousers. The effect on their bearing and appearance is all too often appalling. Grace, charm, beauty, attractiveness and, above all, femininity have totally disappeared.�

ew.

my bad. he takes issue with women NOT wearing skirts. oops.

And of course his charity is "pro family," though the article had the grace to put it in quotes in one instance.

I really hate the monopoly this kind of group has managed to get on that word.

Wait, the name of his group doesn't make any sense! Everyone knows that "mankind" is a totally gender-neutral term and everyone who thinks otherwise is a hysterical feminist looking for things to complain about.

"Drab, dreary and often scruffy, the female has been driven into that most ungainly and often hideous garment – the trousers."

He's right; trousers are ugly, ugly garments and all of them should be burned. Personally, I've been looking for an excuse to get my boyfriend into a mini skirt. If I tell him how hideous he looks in pants, he won't have a choice.

I once had the misfortune to sit in a meeting with this organisation's previous Chair who was arguing for police officers with a history of perpetrating domestic violence to be recruited as specialist domestic violence officers. His view was that this would be helpful on the grounds they would have a good insight into the issues.

As jaws around the room hit the floor he followed it up with 'I don't see what the problem is - after all we don't prevent women who've had abortions from becoming mothers'

What's really scary is that this group is one of many so-called "Fathers' Rights" groups active in the UK, US, and Australia (my work is on what these groups are up to). They claim to want "equal parenting time" but most groups' are regressive, denigrate women, seek to eliminate VAWA (in the U.S.), and reduce alimony and child support obligations of men. They seek to control women's reproductive rights (yes, force women to carry THEIR babies to term) and some groups are even in favor of presumed father-custody of children. Many are racist (as evidenced by the speed with which they embraced Tyler Perry's movie and claimed it accurately depicted the "problem" with African American communities). They claim victimization by the courts (gender bias against men) and that women are just as bad as men when it comes to domestic violence. And of course, they want women back in the kitchen, uneducated, barefoot, and pregnant. One example is angryharry.com. A few (a precious few) groups seem legitimately to advocate for men having meaningful access to their kids. When I get this thing published, I can send a link if folks are interested.

"And, as with most other disasters, such as 9/11, it falls mainly to men to clear up the mess."

By that logic, it takes men to clear up a mess that men created. Fail.

Got some more good quotes here. The Guardian has managed to get a female columnist to complain (yes COMPLAIN) about porn being taken out of hotel rooms. I know.

Kali Ma, angryharry.com is one of the scariest websites I've ever been to. There's so much hatred against women, it just absolutely terrifies me sometimes.

Geez, how insecure in your manhood do you have to be to join an organization like this? Why not just be honest and say, "All I want is a dependant housekeeper that I can fuck."

But you know, whenever I read about some asshole like this, it just reminds me how much I really love and appreciate all the wonderful men in this world who respect women, treat us as equals, and care about us as partners, lovers, friends, family members. There are far too few of them, but I don't think we give that select group enough credit for being above all of this macho, man of the house bullshit.

This quote from the ManKind's media page is a perfect example of its misogyny:

"This part of our website is pro-active and if you agree with the following statements and subsequent examples of Misandry in the Media you can do something about it."

and then...

"The images of men and women as portrayed in the Media are severely damaging relationships between men and women. Men are portrayed as useless, weak and ineffectual. Women are portrayed as aggressive, selfish, vain, and encouraged to have no respect for men."

Following this, they refer to the above as an "attack on men" and never address the aforementioned portrayals of women. I think what they're trying to say is that it doesn't matter because they are sure we women really are those things. PLEASE!

"it falls mainly to men to clear up the mess."

Oh yeah. It falls to the people who think other people should be oppressed, to do the oppressing. Can't count on those selfish other people to subjugate themselves.

Why, this outrage has happened throughout history! The poor KKK, having to clean up the "mess" of blacks having freedom and the right to vote, all by themselves, for example. So unfair.

(I will not break Godwin's Law, I will not break Godwin's Law, I will not . . .)

i am not sure what is wrong with a woman complaining that porn is getting taken out of hotels? unless you are part of the anti-porn (which in alot of ways i feel is anti sex bc most in that group WONT make exceptions for pro-female porn which i dont have an issue with-other stuff i certainly do) feminist contingent, its hardly something i think all feminists will agree on.

Well, I'm glad he cleared that up. If it weren't for all of those women creating messes then the world would be peachy keen. Damn you women!

Oh wait... is he advocating for men to clean more? I think I might actually like him.

Can we PUH-lease not reduce anti-porn to anti-sex? I don't mind having an intelligent conversation about what "feminist porn" would look like or even if there could be such a thing, but hurling the "you just don't like sex" label does violence to the very thoughtful piece by Cruella, who goes to pains to explain why anti-porn is NOT the same as anti-sex. Well done, Cruella.

and has recommended that men not marry women graduates because "they prefer to choose a wife who is less-educated and who will be happy to qualify in the most important degree of all – as wife and mother.�
What, this guy writes for Forbes

men not marry women graduates because "they prefer to choose a wife who is less-educated and who will be happy to qualify in the most important degree of all – as wife and mother.� Charming.

SWEET! Given that more women than men go to college, and a higher percentage go on to grad school, those men won't have many women to marry. Whoops! Looks like you're weeded out of the gene pool! :)

Oenophile--I like the way your mind works. A lot.

You know, if they are so intent about women wearing skirts, I wonder how they feel about the utilikilt. (www.utilikilt.com)

(I'm obsessed with these, I wish I weren't so hippy.)

I was going to make a comment about how I have lots of male Scottish relatives who are perfectly happy in a kilt (I guess they got sick of their ugly trousers). You beat me to it Shinobi. I like the utilikilt...I don't totally get the hedgehog though...did it eat the ugly trousers?

Regarding the division of household duties/who supports the household financially, I know my husband would not be happy with Hughe's ideal. It is not always financially feasible these days to have one partner "bringing home the bacon"....In some households that would mean bringing home the I-can't-believe-it's-not-bacon.

"SWEET! Given that more women than men go to college, and a higher percentage go on to grad school, those men won't have many women to marry. Whoops! Looks like you're weeded out of the gene pool! :)"

Oh. MY. Goodness! I actually agree with oenophile, 100%!! Has hell really frozen over? ;)

"SWEET! Given that more women than men go to college, and a higher percentage go on to grad school, those men won't have many women to marry. Whoops! Looks like you're weeded out of the gene pool!"

Oy...never even thought of that, but you're right. These guys are such misogynists they can't even see the truth staring them in the face.

"His comments come as a Children’s Society survey today shows family life is suffering as parents struggle with the demands of work and childcare."

Right. So that has nothing to do with our struggling economy, or the skyrocketing costs of living,(including health insurance), and lack of adequate support for social programs (including childcare).

Nono. It's those damn UPPITY WOMEN'S FAULT.

Rar.

"What??? Wouldn't it be less incongruous to take issue with women wearing PANTS?"

I once heard of a guy who *both* punished his daughter for wearing pants ("don't act like a man!!!") *and* punished her for wearing skirts ("don't act like a slut!!!"). This was in one of the essays in a nonfiction anthology on body image issues (I read it years ago and forgot the title :( ).

"Why not just be honest and say, 'All I want is a dependant housekeeper that I can fuck."

These are those same guys that you see going to foreign countries and marrying women that don't speak English so they can abuse them and treat them as sex and housework slaves.

"SWEET! Given that more women than men go to college, and a higher percentage go on to grad school, those men won't have many women to marry."

Good! Leave the educated women to me. Women that can quote Michel de Montaigne at length turn me on.

One of my favourite MRA complaints, regurgitated unsurprisingly on the ManKind website, is that girls are outachieving boys in school. Now, in cases where the statistics show that it's the other way around, these guys are quick to assert, in Larry Summers fashion, that it's just a biological thing, not discrimination of any kind. But when the situation improves and suddenly girls start out-achieving boys, it's immediately assumed to be structural. Naturally, no one even suggests that THAT state of affairs might just be biologically determined, and it doesn't even merit comment in the mainstream.

Elise, you rock! I have noted that discrepancy as well, and it really bugs me.

All I can feel upon reading this article is a profound sense of relief. Probably after I get over being grateful that I have two and a bit degrees, I never wear skirts (at least not in public) and children give me hives, I'll manage to work up some outrage.

In the meantime, I'm turning up my misogynist-zapper to maximum.

I remember being at a mock trial invitational a few years ago. After we finished the mock trial, the (male) judge commented on each team's performance. After briefly discussing the mock trial itself, the judge then complimented me for having come in a skirt, and turned to one of the other women on my team, who had gone the route of a very nice black pantsuit (much nicer, in fact, than what I was wearing in just about every respect), that "you should give that some thought; some judges in the competitions can be sticklers."

I own lots of skirts, and dresses, come to that. When the weather gets nice, I generally prefer them, because I like to feel the wind on my legs and I just like how I look in them. But bullshit like that, especially coming from a man, who will never have to follow his own "advice", makes me want to get rid of all of them and just wear dungarees all the time.

Having a guy "advise" you to show more leg is bad enough in and of itself, without the added insult of trying to pretend it's a matter of principle or decorum. "It is simply unseemly for you to come here wearing a garment that doesn't allow easy access to your genitals."

Right.

"He's right; trousers are ugly, ugly garments and all of them should be burned. Personally, I've been looking for an excuse to get my boyfriend into a mini skirt. If I tell him how hideous he looks in pants, he won't have a choice."

Sadly, moriath, I have more than a few "cute" anecdotes featuring my mother's ex-husband and his propensity to don skirts as a "pro-men" statement. "If women can wear pants, why can't men wear skirts?" was his motto. Augh. He was heavily involved in an organization just like ManKind called "MESA" - Men's Educational Support Association - here in Canada. He was good pals with Mel Feit (A man, for those unfamiliar, infamous for championing this Men's rights movement on the talk show circuit, and everywhere else), who stayed with us a few times and summarily creeped me out. For years, growing up, all I heard about from him and this group were sob stories about men falsely accused of rape, men being cruelly torn away from their children by a man-hating legal system, men being victimized by vindictive, heartless wives and ex-wives who used their children as bargaining chips in divorce proceedings. Yeah.

Where is he now? WELL! After years of physical and emotional abuse, my mother finally had enough and divorced him. And now the man who fought so hard for men who desperately loved the children they were apparently unjustly denied access to, doesn't see his son - my little brother - at all, has shown no interest in seeing him, and hasn't paid a dime of child support. I wonder if a man who ironically wore skirts can appreciate the irony of THAT?

Oh, but to his credit, he had no problem with having my mom out in the workforce - with her bringing in all the money, he was free to do whatever the hell he wanted to (not housework, or child-rearing, mind you; my mom did that too). And he basically did. Asshole.

Kali Ma,

When I get this thing published, I can send a link if folks are interested.
I am, I am!