Hey, let 'em burn their bras. For a kids' move, I'd say that's pretty effin sweet.

True nuff.

It's nice to see that a kid's movie is bending gender stereotypes. Very few of the movies that I've seen have done that.

Personally I think the bra burning may be a little much, but then again if it is presented to children by a lovable character, perhaps they will come to realize that feminists aren't all insane bitches.

I say let them burn the bras, the kids can learn a little history.

What I like about the Shrek movies is the size-positive spin on a heroine like Fiona. She's big and beautiful and strong. To me, the fat-positive message in the movies is my favorite thing about them.

Oh...and it's Fiona who gets the girls to drop the "waiting princess" act and do something. And Fiona's mom kicks ass. BIG TIME. Snow White holds her own, of course after Fiona tells her to cut the princess act.

I got a tad pissy at the bra burning, but to most people that symbolizes feminism, so I figure, what the hell.

For all that I'm no fan of the bra-burning meme, it was nice to see a movie go, "Yeah, they're being feminist, dammit" instead of the usual BS of making strong women palatable by excusing it with the so-called "maternal instinct" garbage.

I saw it as, "We're rescuing ourselves because we deserve rescuing and we're not going to hang around and wait for some guy to do it." Which is a bit of a departure, to my mind, from the usual "Oh, /I/ don't deserve rescuing, I'll take whatever's dished out to me, but I'll tear the earth to pieces with my bare hands to save my child/husband/pet bunny rabbit/whatever."

So sure, the bra-burning stereotype is annoying, but if it means we get unapologetically strong women? I'll call it a fair trade. At least for now. grin.

Oh gosh when I saw the bra burning I just wanted to scream "It's a stereotype!!!" But still, I had to smile a little. Finally a movie where the women don't just sit around waiting for a man to save the day. I give it two thumbs up.

See, the problem I had with Shrek 3 is that the moral of the story was apparently, "you can be whatever you want to be if you try hard enough. If you can't change, it's your own fault".

Like, the only reason people aren't chasing Shrek and Fiona with pitchforks is because they decided not to act like ogres (and not because they're hanging out with the king and queen of the realm). What kind of message is that for anyone who doesn't fit society's beauty standard? If you'd just not be so much like yourself, people might treat you like a human being?

*shrug* One day, we're going to see a full-figured female character who is actually human and whose weight is completely irrelevent to those around her, not something that everyone has to work through in order to like the character. One day, maybe. Probably not in my life time.

my problem with the article is that is says she admitted - why not she said? as if identifying with feminism is a bad thing.

uh, apparently the movie's not very good, anyway. i'll save my $10 and be feminist enough for 5 dreamworks bombs

What I don't understand (and never really did) was what is supposed to be so bad about bra-burning? I mean, I can undertand how "man-hating" might be morally suspect. But what exactly is WRONG with not wearing a bra that one would vehemently deny being a "bra-burning" kind of feminist?

Perhaps it's an environmental issue?

Seriously, though - does anyone understand this? It reminds me of the old insult "your mother wears combat boots". No one would take offense at that statement any more. Burning bras might be a stereotype based on a sloppily reported event, but in the end, why is it still something to defend against? If someone wears a bra or doesn't, why do we care?

Agreed, Barbara. My guess is that people are worried that young women are turned off by feminism because of its reputation of "bra-burning" etc. But for myself, I'm happy to be identified with it. A public moment of defiance and protest? Fuck yeah.

OK, feminist plotline my well constructed rump.....
I will likely see this movie soon as I have 3 small ones who loved the first 2, and Mike Myers is a hometown boy for me.

BUT, calling the plot about Fiona feminist is just wrong.

Since the plot revolves around the King dying and who takes over the throne (and forgive me if I don't get all the plot right since I've just read the round-ups and not yet seen it..).

So the King, who originally transformed himself from a frog to marry the rightful heir to the throne - the Queen, names...Shrek his heir?

Excuse me the rightful Monarch is the Queen herself....THEN HER DAUGHTER!!!! Not some guy, or a distant nephew, also male.

So Cameron Diaz can go on about how strong Fiona is all she wants....this is NOT a feminist plot line.

therowan: I was about to say, it's hardly feminist for the blood relative of the royal family to defend the throne in the name of...her husband, whom she considers the king (sure she's the queen, but he's king, so she's defending his kingdom, not her queendom).

Bleh.

And on top of that, she knows Shrek doesn't want to be king, so she's fighting off the coup for...him? What?

Bra burning... I think the idea of unfettered boobs is a little too libidinous for comfort to patriarchal ideals. The stereotype is informed both by the free love movement coinciding with the advent of popular feminism here, and with the stereotype of men as easily swayed sex crazed simians.

I think a more powerful protest would be holding paychecks and cashing them on one afternoon, and noting the numbers the next day... maybe mothers' day or something similar. One of the major gender issues remains pay parity.

Plus...I can't burn my bra. it's polyester with an underwire (burning=bad for environment), and I need it, or my boobs hurt. :-(

As for Shrek...I'd like to address gender issues for real, in a film that doesn't suck, please.

As a Feministing reader when I saw the movie and that scene came up, as soon as they burned the bra I had to refrain myself from blurting outloud "That's a myth! Women didn't burn bras!" But since I was in the Archlight I kept my mouth shut. ;) Still a great sequence though.

It seemed to me that Shrek 3 tried to play itself off as 'feminist' while retaining, without question, male rule. Despite Fiona and her friends' big let's-rescue-ourselves scene, it is assumed and accepted without question that the throne must belong to a man.

The King wants Shrek to rule, but Fiona, his own daughter, is neither asked or apparently even considered. The Queen is still alive and healthy, but aside from smashing walls with her head, she is ignored and completely silent on the issue of ruling the kingdom. The girls get to kick some butt, but only in order to make sure that the right MAN ends up in charge.

The fact that the Shrek movies are supposed to CHALLENGE the old fairy tale cliches--but Shrek 3 completely swallows patriarchal rule without any question at all--is both hypocritical and disturbing.

The in-your-face "feminism" in Shrek 3 is just for laughs, while the patriarchal status quo is untouched and unchallenged.

I think you summed it up perfectly, Broken Paradigm.

As for those of you who haven't seen Shreck 3, I wouldn't bother. It's probably worth renting if you liked the first two, but definately not worth the cost of a movie ticket, popcorn, etc. It was not even close to being as funny or original as the others.

"And on top of that, she knows Shrek doesn't want to be king, so she's fighting off the coup for...him? What?"

Either that or maybe fighting for her chance to be the power behind the throne who really runs the place while assassins aim at someone else? OTOH, how often do movies for kids get that Machiavellian?

I think the bra burning thing is awesome. Most of the kids will think burning your clothes is out of the ordinary. That usually inspires a "why?". I'm guessing that a good chunk of the kids will force their parents (or the internet) to explain feminism. As a bonus, they might even associate Fiona with feminism.

i haven't noticed the marketing and merchandising for this Shrek, but in the past i feel like any strong messages for girls via Fiona has been undercut by the fact that all the Fiona merchandise (happy meal toys, tshirts, etc) depicts human Fiona - the beautiful skinny one - and not the ogre. i know that was true for the last movie, even when she spent most of it as an ogre, if i remember correctly.

Shrek 3 was really good, but a few things bothered me. This was one of them. I *DID* turn to my boyfriend at that point and say "That's actually just an urban legend!" about the bra-burning. As much as I admire attempts to break out of the fairytale-princess style characters, this is still just an attempt, and kind of a sad one at that. Amy Poehler as Snow White was pretty funny, though.

Another thing I don't like about Shrek: Transphobia and Homophobia. This SERIOUSLY needs to be addressed. There seems to be an obsession with transwomen who definately do not pass as female going on, and it doesn't seem to be very supportive. The masculine female characters are a huge running joke. And a favorite line from the second movie was one about Pinocchio wearing women's underwear. Why all the gender-bender-bashing? It pisses me off.

I would think gender bending be included is a step forward period. Shrek is a funny movie, it's making fun of things, that they can be included doesn't necessarily seem like a bad thing to me. I dunno.

I thought the bra burning was pretty hokey, but, that's Shrek sometimes. I didn't like this one nearly as much as the last one.

Shrek is a spoof concept, a larger-than-life prototype of kid's 'monstrous' feelings, and examining them to defuse the 'horror'. The movie takes the opportunity to lampoon lots of concepts within that context.

I found it interesting that of 4 women and an ogress, there was one bra to burn. And none of the 'silhouettes' changed. One bra. Why burn it? And as for 'feminism', I didn't get that part, either. Women have been defending their homes and loved ones for many years before the activists in California 'lit up' the 1960's. Nope. The scene in Shrek 3 was a joke, intended to be a joke, and mostly perceived that way.

To me, feminism is not an action, but a fundamental change in life values. We certainly didn't see any of that in the women of Shrek the Third.

We did see Shrek actively cleaning and parenting the babies, at the end. Sort of a subliminal 'empowerment' statement. Of course, Shrek is also essentially unemployed, so is this a 'Mr. Mom' scenario, or an expression of feminism? Hmm.