I agree. It's another case in which parents are told that good, old-fashioned restriction of privelidges will solve everything. It's just teen angst, after all.

But seriously, that's probably the worst thing you can do. I would be more inclined to support the idea of actually talking to the girl (or boy) about the relationship, and, because everything I'd want to do to the bastard/bitch where it my kid who was being abused would be illegal, I'd get the police involved.

But no, the answer is always the same; any time something goes wrong in a teenager's life, take away the phone and computer. That'll fix it.

This also follows the pattern of restricting/punishing the victim rather than the offender. No, parents, don't encourage your kid to FILE CHARGES (which is what anti-stalking laws are for); just use this as an opportunity to limit the victim's behavior, since everybody knows that's going to make such a big fucking difference.

Cheers,

TH

I cant argue with the reasoning that simply taking away the phone/computer can make the situation drastically worse.

My thoughts actually would be the harassing taking place over phones and computers would be a good thing. That way it might make it easier if the police have to get involved and its clear what is going on. Better than waiting for when the victim is alone outside, or something like that.

[sarcasm]Im not a professional however, so maybe taking away or restricting what these harassing messages are coming through (pretty much ignoring the problem) is the best thing to do....[/sarcasm]

What is the idea behind that exactly? That teenagers who use phones/computers less, arent going to be harassed? Or that restricting it while the harassing is going on will help it stop?

Is everyone just assuming it's only the victims who have their phones taken away? I assumed that meant to take away teens' phones so they couldn't stalk and harass their SOs.

Of course then the problem is that they stew for a day or two, come up with bizarre scenarios in their heads, and then take it out on the person later. I think more qualified counselors should be in schools, but what do I know?

I've got to disagree here. If my daughter or son was being abused, and the tool of the abuse was the phone or the computer, I think throwing away the phone or turning off the computer would be incredibly liberating, symbolically cutting the rope tying them to the abuser. That is assuming, of course, that my child wanted the abuse to end. Since teens normally live at home, the only way the abuser has access to them is through the phone or computer (while they are at home). End the access, end the abuse. Get them a new phone and new email address and make sure the abuser does not have access to it. But letting the abuse continue through the phone or internet is not responsible parenting, in my opinion.

Yes, I agree. I'm amazed by how many parents fail to realize that if they formed real relationships with their teenagers, they might be able to talk about such an issue in a meaningful way. Do they forget that their teenagers are actual people? Why not focus on helping girls in this situation become self confident and independent? I don't by any means mean to say that all girls in abusive relationships lack self esteem, but if I were a mother, I would want to help my daughter want to avoid such relationships and want to get out of them as soon as possible.

On the other hand, at least while an abusive relationship is being dealt with, I would think that parents would want to read the threats rather than ignore them. It would probably be a good idea for a girl in this situation to stop responding to the messages, but it seems that action (whether simply checking in with the girl on the situation, or going to the police) is the more appropriate response. Teenagers are people with certain rights, but they need their parents' help with such extreme situations. At the very least, wouldn't a parent want to show his/her daughter that ignoring or silencing an abuser's voice can be powerful not only in weakening the relationship, but also in gaining strength?

I'm not sure whether ignoring the threats would exacerbate an abuser's behavoir, but parents should know enough about their teenagers' lives that they don't simply take away phones and computers then sit at home wringing their hands, worrying passively.

I dunno. I have witnessed and been party to stalking and new media does facilitate the process. I agree that limiting use of the "victim" is an ass-backwards solution. I think the best idea is for parents to be engaged in their children's lives. Because the reality is that parents will never be able to police cyberspace.

I have a kid right now who is totally addicted to cell phoning, messaging, and internet use, and I have been trying to restrict his use of them because it is taking up all of his time (not that he is getting abused), and it is not easy. For a few weeks I took away the power cord to the internet box which was the only way to do it. Parents have to set limits based on how their kids handle privileges. Regarding the abuse of teens by teens, I would think the parents would perhaps try to contact the abuser's parents, or contact the school (assuming they meet IRL in school) and of course have a lot of discussion with the abused teen about what s/he thinks should be done about it. Including filing charges (the texts and IM's, if saved, can constitute written evidence as someone upthread said).

I don't think this is an either/or thing though, a parent's actions have to be based on the individual teen's situation. And if the teen in question is mature about internet/phone use and is not completely addicted to them to the extent of ignoring other responsibilities like school work, it seems that restricting the abused one from the communication thing is not going to really solve things (if the abuse is physically happening, obviously they are seeing the person IRL somewhere as well as being contacted this way).

"I've got to disagree here. If my daughter or son was being abused, and the tool of the abuse was the phone or the computer, I think throwing away the phone or turning off the computer would be incredibly liberating, symbolically cutting the rope tying them to the abuser."

...and symbolically saving your daughter or son from the dire fate of being able to call 911 (or whatever the emergency services number is in your area) and get an ambulance, police officer, or fire truck promptly in the event of abuse or some other emergency happening far from a land line before the new cell phone service is ready.

"It would probably be a good idea for a girl in this situation to stop responding to the messages, but it seems that action (whether simply checking in with the girl on the situation, or going to the police) is the more appropriate response."

How about both? You can forward an abusive email to someone who can help without sending a response to the abuser.

The fact that they are blamin technology for abuse reminds me of how peole day that "guns kill people". Guns don't kill people. People kill people.

Or in this case, technology doesn't cause abuse. Other people do.

Limiting freedom to stop abuse is a bit too drastic. That's like sheltering your children so that they aren't exposed to anything potentially harmful. That in itself can easlily be considered abuse. I should know. My mother did that to me out of sheer overreaction when someone asked me via email (yes, she read my emails) what state I lived in. It was a pretty innocent question. As a result, since I had no friends anyway, she ended up completely cutting of what social life I had outside of school. I still hate her for it 9 years later. It also showed she didn't trust me, though I had given her no reason not to.

I thought that the idea was not to take the phone away once abuse had begun, but rather never let the child even begin be accessible to friends via cell 24-7, so that there is never any expectation of full and constant availability.

Oh boy...I actually have some personal experience with this. When I was about 17 I went on a couple of dates with a guy who ended up stalking me. He not only went in my house when no one was home, stole my underwear (ick!!!!!), and followed me, but he also called me about a million times an hour. Taking away my phone would have been a BAD idea- how would I have called the police if something had happened?
Just my experience.
(FYI, I was in college at the time, not high school, so my parents wouldn't have tried to take my phone anyway. But I still think it would have been a bad idea.)

Maybe I'm missing something that the rest of you are reading into this article, but i don't see anything wrong with limiting cell-phone/internet usage in extreme cases of harrassment or abuse amongst teens. Obviously, simply taking away the phone won't do any good. Parents will aslo need to communicate with the teen to find out what is going on and collaboratively work on stratagies to help the teen get past the abusive relationship and gain back their self esteem. Parents also need to explain to their child that the relationship is in fact abusive and that the victim of abuse is not to blame (contrary to what the victim might be feeling).
Can you imagine if your son or daughter wasn't able to sleep at night for fear of missing a phone call or because of constant phone calls (up to 30/night!)
And honestly, if a person is unfortunate enough to be in an abusive relationship, anwering the phone every time is not going to save the victim. The abuser will always find an excuse to inflict emotional or physical pain on their partner.
Again, punishing a teen by simply taking away their phone/internet won't solve anything. But restricting their use my be part of a solution which also involves communication within the family and other plans (like contacting police and therapy).
And in the case that one's own child is the abuser. Hell yeah take away their phone/internt. But again family communication and therapy are also going to be needed.

I agree with oudemia. The recommendation is to limit cell phone use at night. I assume this is supposed to mean while you teen is at home. They can dial 911 on the landline if need be. And if you establish a general policy before there is a specific problem, its hard to see how an abuser could develop that expectation of full and constant availability.

Part of a parent's responsibility is to create some limitations on their kids activities and their exposure to different people. That's why kids have to get permission to do stuff frequently. So if electronic communication is compromising those restrictions, it makes sense to limit them. And in the way that's being recommmended, I don't think its likely to create much risk.

You also have to look at it from the perspective of Dr. Murray- parents ostensibly know that they're supposed to know what's going on in their kids lives (whether they do a good job of it or not), but here is another idea for how to make the situation more manageable: create limits for electronic communication.

By the way, I'm not advocating restricting phone usage all day. I agree with many of you, in that, if my child was being harrassed I would definetly want him/her to have a cell phone handy when not at home.

This whole situation is very complicated. Even going to the police and dealing with it publicly is dangerous becuase the teen still has to be in contact with the abuser and their friends, who will often take the side of the abuser becuase they are ignorant to the fact of what abuse is and means. These "band-aid solutions" are nice to try to patch up what has already happened, but to really fix it we need sociatal changes (more extensive networks and education in the schools themselves). I know a few girls when I was in high school had reported rape and while there was "punishment" for the abusers, the girls also suffered socially and whatnot. I'm not sure taking away the phone and computer will stop the abuse, like others have said it may just change the way the abuser gets to the abused. And going to the police, parents of the abuser, and school officals may create other problems for the abused that stem from the public knowledge of the abuse.

"I've got to disagree here. If my daughter or son was being abused, and the tool of the abuse was the phone or the computer, I think throwing away the phone or turning off the computer would be incredibly liberating, symbolically cutting the rope tying them to the abuser."

"...and symbolically saving your daughter or son from the dire fate of being able to call 911 (or whatever the emergency services number is in your area) and get an ambulance, police officer, or fire truck promptly in the event of abuse or some other emergency happening far from a land line before the new cell phone service is ready."

Well, I would let my child keep the phone until new service was set up, or give them my cell phone. Hopefully I could survive being without it for a few days. I see this as protection. If someone is threatening or abusing my child, then I will to whatever is necessary to protect them. If someone is stalking you, you change your behavior to give them less opportunity to hurt you. Its not fair; it shouldn't be that way; there should be social changes; the police should be more helpful; schools should have better counseling; but all those don't change the fact that if your child in in danger, you have to take steps to protect them. It is punishing the victim, but that's the natural consequence of any kind of protection. Its not fair for witnesses of violent crime to have move to a hotel or be under constant police survellance, but its necessary to protect them. The blame goes to the abuser for causing first the abuse and then the additionally annoying things the victim has to put with, like changing their phone number.

The abuse involving phones can be varied.

I can't tell you how many times I have gotten in the middle of 'domestic arguments' where the boyfriend refused to let the woman have her phone back.

It is just another way to control someone. Sort of like that story of the guy who shoved a phone down his girlfriend's throat.

In this case, it is good, i think, because the abuse becomes documented (as opposed to yelling in private). this would be a perfect time for school guidance counselors and parents to talk to girls about how to protect themselves and tell guys that this is not okay, and that they will get in deep shit.

but that would be hard, so lets just take out the battery, stick out fingers in our ears and scream 'lalalala"

I was stalked during college, so let me weigh in.

First, get over yourselves. Don't go into hysterial mode at the faintest whiff of something that seems 1950ish, because it could be the most helpful thing ever.

Yes, parents should take away the cells at night - girls and boys.

When I was in a semi-abusive relationship, the guy would FLIP if I were not always accessible. He once screamed at me for "Not being home when I got back from school." Yeah, buddy, it's not my job.

Cells are a GREAT way for abusers to keep total control. Taking away the cell limits access (and does it in a way that the girl isn't responsible - if she doesn't pick up, he'll get mad; if the 'rents take the cell away, tough luck for him). If she needs 911, get her a Firefly.

Parents are under NO OBLIGATION to provide constant access to their teenagers by SOs, abusive or not.

Sorry for being so harsh about this, but it's really apparent that none of y'all have been in abusive, controlling relationships. The thing you want most is to just get a break from him, even if you aren't ready to leave.

Oenophile, I love how you are the wise one around here and get to tell the rest of us to get over ourselves or grow up or whatever, and no this isn’t the first time. I also love that you presume that none of us could possibly have been in an abusive relationship because if we had we would most certainly agree with you on how they need to be handled. It seems to me you are the one who needs to get over yourself and cut the self-righteous condescending crap.

Taking away a teenager's access to cell phone and computer communications will make every aspect of her social life harder. She will see it as a punishment and deny that she is being controlled/abused in an attempt to keep the parent from taking away her freedom. This will cause her to defend her controller/abuser and become more secretive around her family to avoid further punishment. Look, when I was in a relationship like that all my mom did was point out that my boyfriend was controlling me - using my phone like a leash. Teenagers don't want to be controlled-by anyone. I started hanging up or not answering at all.

thank you sojourner... cell phones are facilitating the abuse not causing it. Taking it away may stop the calls, but the abuser will still find ways to abuse, I would personally know

"Sorry for being so harsh about this, but it's really apparent that none of y'all have been in abusive, controlling relationships."

Are you kidding? DAMN. Narcissm any??

ah, the good old "remedy" of slapping a band-aid on a cut that needs stitches...

instead we would do better to get to the root of the problem - confront the idea that it is socially acceptable to abuse another human being and figure out why this abuse is so widespread in the first place.

"instead we would do better to get to the root of the problem - confront the idea that it is socially acceptable to abuse another human being and figure out why this abuse is so widespread in the first place."

yeah make women's studies a requirement K-12.

for both boys and girls

Riiight, sojourner. (Rolls eyes.) Because heaven forbid that a woman who doesn't follow your narrow vision of the world actually have an opinion. I've been there, done that, and I'm supposed to just sit quietly on my hands?

If your kid is not sleeping because of the cell phone, then he or she is not responsible enough for it. So you take it away.

It's called parenting, people.

Many teenagers do not pay their cell phone bills. Even if they do, that does not mean that they get to use them with impunity. Parents are under no obligation to provide abusers with access to their children.

Let's figure this out. Parents take away a kid's cell phone. What will the abuser do? From personal experience, my guess is that he would go over to the house or call the landline. Then you get angry parents who can directly intercede on behalf of their kids.

When I was in college, he called the police when I was an hour late coming to his house. I stopped at my best friend's house beforehand, and, instead of doing the logical thing (i.e. swinging by friend's house & seeing my car out front), he involved my parents, called the cops, and choked me because I made him "so worried." Yeah, the penalties for not being available are harsh, but that is all the more reason for parents to fight on behalf of their daughters.

He demanded access to me. He would get mad when I wasn't in my room and phone accessible. I literally had no privacy when I was near a phone - no life of my own. The fact that I did not have a cell phone, this being the late 90s, was a blessing.

So yeah, I'm going to tell y'all that you might want to re-think your stance. Parents have a right and a responsibility to ensure that their children are not in unhealthy relationships. They are also not obligated ot give their kids unfettered access to cell phones, computers, land phones, and the like.

Yes, kids rebel. But if you were to say that you simply didn't care if it was the best friend Liz calling at night or the crazy boyfriend, and rules are reasonable and are conditions of a cell phone, the kid has no real basis to complain. It also helps if the parents communicate the rules to the boyfriend.

I got rid of the jerk, in part, when I was in a different situation where I was able to have time away from him and really really wanted it. That kick-started me into chucking him (and, of course, triggered the stalking). Removing the vehicle for constant access (cells, IM in the middle of the night) gives young women a chance to live their own life. Abusers work by slowly taking over her life. It is incredibly helpful to remind her of what her life was like before him.

...but Heaven forbid that the method have even a faint whiff of this "patriarchy" thing.

yeah make women's studies a requirement K-12.
4% of the population are sociopaths who think themselves above social rules and law. I don't think that women's studies will change psychological disorders.

"Let's figure this out. Parents take away a kid's cell phone. What will the abuser do? From personal experience, my guess is that he would go over to the house or call the landline. Then you get angry parents who can directly intercede on behalf of their kids."

But why can't the intercede in the first place, when they see the need to take away the phone because someone is harrassing their child over it? Why wait and put your child in potetially more danger?

Now, I'm not saying teens should have acess to their phones 24/7, but taking the phone away would seem to me like a really bad thing to do. The abuser would get frusterated and angrier and go to find them, while if you have the phone, you can make the choice (a scary choice, but a choice nonetheless) to tell someone and stop picking up the phone.

Ah! Oenophile, I never said you should sit quiet on your hands. I was only referring to your lovely self-righteous condescending lecturing ways, telling others “First, get over yourselves. Don't go into hysterial�, and “it's really apparent that none of y'all have been in abusive, controlling relationships� etc. I can find you examples from your past comments as well but I can’t be bothered.

“but Heaven forbid that the method have even a faint whiff of this "patriarchy" thing.� Yeah because the "patriarchy" thing is a figment of our imagination and needs to be put in scare quotes.

Scare quotes? I've heard that term and found it nothing but amusing and irrational. Why not just quotes? "Scare" quotes? Wow. :)

It is really really obvious who has been in an abusive relationship (those people say to take away the lines of communication) and those who haven't (who think that a parent who takes away a daughter's cell phone so she can sleep is the epitome of the patriarchy).

Abuse is not a one-time thing. Sleepless nights, constant monitoring, and the requirement to remain accessible are constant elements in an abused woman's life. "Letting the girl take the call" so he doesn't do x, y, or z is a temporary solution to a permanent problem - a solution that needs to be repeated every hour, every day and just makes the problem worse.

It is REALLY sad to see "feminists" who need smelling salts at this "patriarchal" move when it's about as sexist as escorting a woman home so she doesn't get attacked. I can't help but think that anyone who gets upset over what the parents are doing as "sexist" really need a clue. What's more sexist: ensuring that an abuser doesn't have constant access to your daughter so she can sleep at night, or de facto approving of the abuse by doing absolutely nothing?

Ooohhh.... "patriarchy." If that's even on the patriarchy radar, then feminism has won.

From Merriam-Webster:

Main Entry:
scare quotes
Function:
noun plural
Date:
1960

: quotation marks used to express especially skepticism or derision concerning the use of the enclosed word or phrase

It is REALLY sad to see "feminists" who need smelling salts at this "patriarchal" move when it's about as sexist as escorting a woman home so she doesn't get attacked. I can't help but think that anyone who gets upset over what the parents are doing as "sexist" really need a clue. What's more sexist: ensuring that an abuser doesn't have constant access to your daughter so she can sleep at night, or de facto approving of the abuse by doing absolutely nothing?

This would indeed be sad, if anyone here had actually said it. Strangely, no one has. Some have pointed out that blaming or punishing the victim doesn't do much to stop the abuser from being abusive, and some have mentioned that making the issue public and/or taking away the phone can have a negative impact on the teen's social life, but I've yet to see a comment anywhere in this thread making the claim that taking away the phone is "OMG SEXISM!! Submission to teh PATRIARCHY!!11!" except for yours, oenophile. So I have to wonder: Are you mistakenly commenting in the wrong thread, or just arguing with yourself?

Geez...no one ever thought of simply changing the number and letting the youngster keep her phone for emergencies?